When it doesn't fit anywhere else
 #80504  by pmak
 
jeffm725 wrote:

There are a couple schools of thought here. The prevailing one seems to be that they DID NOT all die in the plane crash. Everything that happened was real up to the "flash sideways" world. All the losties died at different times, but needed to remember their deaths to be able to "go on" . The flash sideways world was like a purgatory ( although the connotation does not entirely fit and I dont like the term, but it works as a way to start to understand what was going on there).
There is obviously A LOT more to it than that, but that seems to be what the writers were trying to get across.

Bottom line though, there was a Dharma initiative and an Oceanic 6 and all that stuff.

Ben did not enter the church because he had not died yet.
Definitely right, the ending left it open to a couple of interpretations but I think Jack's conversation towards the end with his Dad kind of points to what you said (flash sideways was some sort of purgatory). That's why Desmond was telling everyone to "let go". The island was real and actually did happen, the flash sideways was a life they had in their "minds" to eventually bring them together so they could move on with their loved ones. Anybody catch all of the religious symbols from all the different religions in the stained glass windows of the church?

And I think Ben was dead at the end (and hence in the "purgatory"). Christian said to Jack something like "We are all dead, whether they died before you or after you." Time is irrelevant (or not congruent with the real world) in the purgatory world, so whether they died in 2004 or in 2050, they were there. Hence why Hurley said to Ben that he was a good #2. They lived for a while after Jack died (along with Sawyer and Kate who got off the island possibly in the plane). I think Ben was either punishing himself or was waiting for Alex before he could move on.

Them showing the plane at the end throws me for a loop. Could also mean everyone died in the initial crash or it could have been the plane Sawyer and Kate and everyone was on trying to get off the island at the end. Or it could have just been the producers way of signing off.

Obviously this is all just my opinion, but what was great about this show is that it is open to interpret it any way you want. Wonderfully written and beautifully executed.
 #80506  by strumminsix
 
pmak wrote: Them showing the plane at the end throws me for a loop. Could also mean everyone died in the initial crash or it could have been the plane Sawyer and Kate and everyone was on trying to get off the island at the end. Or it could have just been the producers way of signing off.
Rumor has it that ABC added that and it was simply shot of the set. Read - no significance.

I tend to find that plausible.
 #80520  by jefkahn
 
strumminsix wrote:
pmak wrote: Them showing the plane at the end throws me for a loop. Could also mean everyone died in the initial crash or it could have been the plane Sawyer and Kate and everyone was on trying to get off the island at the end. Or it could have just been the producers way of signing off.
Rumor has it that ABC added that and it was simply shot of the set. Read - no significance.

I tend to find that plausible.
The plane flying over Jack when he was in the bamboo field was certainly the plane Kate and Sawyer were on.

The pieces of plane on the beach shown during the ending credits? That was an odd thing to show, but I figured those pieces had been on the beach since the original Oceanic crash (how would they have been moved?), and seeing them there doesn't suggest to me everyone died in that crash.
 #80528  by strumminsix
 
jefkahn wrote:The plane flying over Jack when he was in the bamboo field was certainly the plane Kate and Sawyer were on.
Proof? Not being antagonistic but to say "certainly" is a bit of a stretch. Assuming towards the end we saw 3 events in relative time with each other:
- Lapidus & Co getting the plane working
- Sawyer & Co getting to the plane
- Jack & Co getting to the light cave

We see the plane taking off amidst a storm and chaos. We see Jack get to do his thing, realize it works, get knocked out, get flushed out of the cave, regain consciousness, see the plane.

While I agree it's likely supposed to be the plane I cannot say for certain.
 #80529  by Crazy 9.5 Fingers
 
I still need a few more days to let it marinate. I guess there is definitely room for interpretation.

Do we assume Whidmore and Michael didn't get invited to the shindig at the church as they had a one way ticket to the fiery city? :twisted:
 #80530  by strumminsix
 
Crazy 9.5 Fingers wrote:Do we assume Whidmore and Michael didn't get invited to the shindig at the church as they had a one way ticket to the fiery city? :twisted:
I'm going with it was a unique bond of only those in attendance.
 #80553  by jefkahn
 
Crazy 9.5 Fingers wrote:Do we assume Whidmore and Michael didn't get invited to the shindig at the church as they had a one way ticket to the fiery city? :twisted:
We know from a few episodes ago that Michael is stuck on the island (in ghost form) because of his sins he committed while alive and on the island. I wondered why Ben wouldn't also have been stuck on the island in ghost form for his sins. Maybe he did a lot of good after committing his sins.
 #80554  by strumminsix
 
jefkahn wrote:Maybe he did a lot of good after committing his sins.
He was Hurley's #2 on the island for a period of time. Hurley complimented him on what he did in that role. Gaining redemption from that is a logical assumption.
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