[causebass]

my guitar player and I have an ongoing discussion about putting effects in the vocal monitors..I say keep it dry and not muddy up the vocals, he says he needs to hear whatever reverb or delay is going to the mains so he can work his vocals with the effects, now since he sings most of the tunes,he gets first call...but what do you folks in bands think about this??

http://www.theCAUSEjams.com

[lostsailor8782]

I have done hundreds of gigs and have never once put effects in the monitors

[tigerstrat]

my guitar player and I have an ongoing discussion about putting effects in the vocal monitors..I say keep it dry and not muddy up the vocals, he says he needs to hear whatever reverb or delay is going to the mains so he can work his vocals with the effects, now since he sings most of the tunes,he gets first call...but what do you folks in bands think about this??

http://www.theCAUSEjams.com

I'm with you, vocals should be monitored DRY, however if he does most of the singing, I would try to work out a compromise... I take it that you usually share a monitor mix?

[strumminsix]

I'm the oddball. IMO I think the monitors should be what is heard out of the mains. Especially if somebody is mixing from the stage.

[Dozin]

I like the effects in the monitor too. When I can hear my voice a millisecond after I sing something. It helps me hear myself and I can work my vocal better.

[myoung6923]

I absolutely agree that monitors should for the most part reflect what's coming out of the mains. Think of not hearing the effects from your guitar on stage - playing it dry and just trying to keep in mind that the sound coming out of the mains sounds actually different somewhat from what you are playing. You wouldn't do that because you need that to hear what you are sounding like so that you can play effectively with that effect. Vocals are also somewhat like that. Especially with a little delay on the vocals - you can play with that effect vocally - but only if you can hear it.

In pro rigs, concert settings, touring bands... that's how it's done. For several years I worked setting up staging and equipment for all kinds of bands, from small theaters to outdoor stadiums - including 5 dead shows - and worked for a production company that ran sound and lighting for local (denver) acts - and in virtually ALL of these, that's how it's done.

[tigerstrat]

I like to be able to hear my voice pitch as clearly as possible, and I like a pretty loud monitor level, so that I can really work the mic for parts sung both very quietly and close to the mic or head-thrown-back-loud; reverb/delay almost always tend to lower your feedback threshold, especially in a club with a big wall right behind the backline of amps. I don't need it completely dry, just coherent enough for me to know what's actually coming out of my mouth. It's definitely less of a preference factor for me on larger stages, with less reflective crazinesss behind or above.

[strumminsix]

Agree TS about reverb and feedback.

I usually set the reverb a bit less on the monitors for that reason.

[pappypgh]

Hey now,
I'm the guitar player mentioned in the first post on this thread. I'll tell y'all WHY I believe it NECESSARY for effects in the monitors....for ME.

First off - EXCELLENT POINT about not hearing your effects through your amp if you're a guitarist and only having them come out of the mains. That'd sure be stupid, wouldn't it?

If you USE, and I mean USE effects on your vocals, as a vocalist, then you MUST SURELY have effects in the monitors.

If you are content to sing and let the soundman worry about the effects, then SURELY you would probably want the monitors dry.

Neither way is right or wrong for everyone. MY argument is that I sing 99% of the songs, we share a mix, so get over it!!

If I'm singing, "Estimated Prophet," I want the delay to come through the monitors, so I can HAVE FUN WITH IT! Is it also fun if the soundman has HIS fun and I get surprised by that? Sure. But I'm having my most fun when I can control what's going on.

Reverb is the same way for me. If I'm singing, "Black Peter," for instance, I want that breath of reverb, nice & wet, on my vocals, so I can WORK the vocals. There's more to singing, IMO, than just singing the melody in my own voice. I work the reverb and it creates an ambience that you simply will not get from your average bar room.

If I'm singing Carnegie Hall, I'll let you know if I need electrically enhanced reverb on top of the room's natural reverb. I'll call you when I get there!!

[mttourpro]

But I'm having my most fun when I can control what's going on.

hhhmmmmmmmmm......


I couldn't resist.

[pappypgh]

I KNEW one of my boys would say something about that.

What I MEANT by that was I have the most fun when I have the most control of things I'M doing.

But I KNEW the Tour Pro would chime in. I had him at 67% of chiming in first and David at a mere 22%.

www.theCAUSEjams.com

[mttourpro]

LOL!! You're pretty quick there Pappy!

I hope you bet the farm.

[causebass]

oh pity the poor bassist....sure we hold down the bottom and often drive the bus...but we have little weight when it comes to important issues like adding(or removing) effects to the vocal monitors...we must bow our heads and let those who know everything (like lead guitarist and lead vocalist..and when they are the same WATCH OUT!!!) so back to my lonely unappreciated position of bass player...and I will keep from making suggestions about our stage monitor..and go back to worshiping the ground our frontman walks on

hehehehe love ya Eric!!


http://www.theCAUSEjams.com

[pappypgh]

Okay enough band politics from one band on one thread. It's getting kinda...well...you know. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Listen, Bassboy....you're almost up to 6 strings now. When you get there, we'll talk.

HAHA

Later

[myoung6923]

Pappy -

IMO you are absolutely 100% correct.