Grateful Dead Music Forum

Earlier this week I had my mind set on a Fargen Blackbird 20W. I had narrowed it down to what I want in an amp and thats what I came up with. Stellar clean sound, ability to reach a nice rich OD without having to make your ears bleed. I hadnt actually played through one but I had not heard one bad comment about them and lots of people who had bought one sold their Vintage BF amps in favor of the Fargen. If you dont know the Blackbird is modeled after a Deluxe Reverb, Ben Fargen says to imagine the best sounding DR youve ever heard.
I figured that Fender Reissues are overpriced at the moment and would never compare to the quality of a boutique Amp. I know guys on here will say go vintage, but theyre just hard to find, especially smaller ones like Princetons. I bring up Princetons because Im not looking for a huge amp like a Twin. Something small and portable that sounds really good. Plus its not unusual for vintage Princetons to go for over 1000 bucks anyway. However, I went to my local Best Buy tonight on a whim and they had the Princeton Reverb Reissue for $620. This is the cheapest this amp has EVER BEEN. Ive been weighing the pros and cons but what would you do?


PRRI
Pros -
Cheap
2 inputs

Cons-
not Point to point.
presumably does not sound as good
10" speaker
Assembly line quality - Fender quality these days is hit or miss
Depreciates as soon as I carry it out of the store

Fargen BB
Pros-
Point to Point wiring
Better tone
12" speaker
Built like a tank, not mass produced, better quality in every way.
I really like the fact that it has a Mid control and Bright switch
Better resale value

Cons-
$1500 for a head
$1800 for a combo
at ~3x the price, will it really sound 3x better?


Pick one

I think it might be worth looking into a Mesa combo.

You can get a nice bell tone ala Jerry when you dial the clean channel in.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Mesa-Boogie-Mark-II ... 53ded247f9

http://cgi.ebay.com/Mesa-Boogie-Mark-II ... 3a55b9e58f

Here are a couple of options.

They hold their value, and there is a larger market for resale.

60w is too much power and I want reverb on the amp. Plus Jerry tone is not really something I go for these days, more John Mayer/SRVish:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONeTSGF0 ... re=related

My recommendation would be to find a working silver face Fender Deluxe Reverb, circa '68 thru '76 or so. Get the real thing, and have it tuned up (caps, tubes, etc.). No better amp in the world. I'd rather have a beat old real FDR than even a nice boutique copy. I'd completely pass on any of the Fender reissue stuff. Not great amps at all. They can sound ok, but seem to miss the mark a bit. And the reissues suck to work on. Real Fender (hand wired point to point) amps are the best when it comes to servicing or tweaking. More mojo.


Brad

I agree with Brad. Have you looked into Rivera Amps?

Blackbird - yes it will sound 3X better than the PRRI.

IMO my Fargen sounds better than most vintage Fenders.

I would stay away from the re-issues .....
There is always someone checking in here with R.I. "issues" .....
They wont last 30/40 years like the real deal
10' speaker too
This Fargen amp sounds interesting too.If I had to pick I would say go that way .....
Hold out for the real deal dude - in the end you will be happier !
Good luck

Tennessee Jedi wrote:I would stay away from the re-issues .....
There is always someone checking in here with R.I. "issues" .....
They wont last 30/40 years like the real deal
10' speaker too
This Fargen amp sounds interesting too.If I had to pick I would say go that way .....
Hold out for the real deal dude - in the end you will be happier !
Good luck

thats what I figured too, just needed to hear someone else tell me it haha. I figured that even if I bought the PRRI, in a couple years id probably just want the Fargen anyway. So might as well just go for the gold now and not have to worry about an amp again

caspersvapors wrote:

Tennessee Jedi wrote:I would stay away from the re-issues .....
There is always someone checking in here with R.I. "issues" .....
They wont last 30/40 years like the real deal
10' speaker too
This Fargen amp sounds interesting too.If I had to pick I would say go that way .....
Hold out for the real deal dude - in the end you will be happier !
Good luck

thats what I figured too, just needed to hear someone else tell me it haha. I figured that even if I bought the PRRI, in a couple years id probably just want the Fargen anyway. So might as well just go for the gold now and not have to worry about an amp again

CV - my Fargen amp is my only amp purchase I have never thought differently on in hindsight.

Can you expect to have a decent stage volume as a lead player while giging with a Deluxe reverb? That question is ultimately made me get a twin, although I get annoyed that I can never really get it too hot unless we're rehearsing.

Seriously, I don't think you need to spend $1800 on a Deluxe sized amp. Try to find a used silverface Fender Deluxe Reverb from the 70's. There's a lot you can do with that.

Jim

AMEN BROTHER!!

mijknahs wrote:Seriously, I don't think you need to spend $1800 on a Deluxe sized amp. Try to find a used silverface Fender Deluxe Reverb from the 70's. There's a lot you can do with that.

Jim

SarnoMusicSolutions wrote:AMEN BROTHER!!

mijknahs wrote:Seriously, I don't think you need to spend $1800 on a Deluxe sized amp. Try to find a used silverface Fender Deluxe Reverb from the 70's. There's a lot you can do with that.

Jim

I would have said that too a few years back. However I love my Fargen amp.

Especially the Bass control where there is a usable sweet of a sweet spot.

Not that "classic Fender 2.8" and at 2.5 your tone is anemic but at 3 your tone is muddy.

YUCK!

There is something similar in most of my Fenders around the mid too but it's a bit wider.

If other amps have broader sweet spots, please do tell me!

I love having an amp where the lower third of the low pot is great for bass, middle third for mids, and upper third treble

and Im sure your amp being custom and all was much more than 1800?

caspersvapors wrote:and Im sure your amp being custom and all was much more than 1800?

Just a couple hundred more. Here is what I have different:
- unique OT from MM which is exactly half the Twin's
- Weber NeoMag speakers which are diff than his norm
- Port Arthur tube rect which is not the norm
- added in a padded input

Otherwise he said it was nearly identical to the BB.