Grateful Dead Music Forum

Brents vocals really added a certain richness to their harmonies that Donna just couldn't do. I tend to like male vocals better in general, it's not a sexist thing, just a matter of preference. Donna's voice in particular really annoys me though. Love that Playin' on DP 1 when you brace yourself for the shriek and then it isn't there, haha.

Europe '72, Pig and Keith for me. Anyone who didn't hear Keith wasn't listening. Early on, before the drugs took over, he was melodic, delivered on leads, and at that point was just as important as Bobby or Phil for that matter. Check out Wembley stadium 4-8-72. Sweet leads from Keith, great vocals from Pig, a good time had by all.

i voted pig/tc as i think they were a stronger creative force than the others, although kieth in the early 70s was amazing. i was never a huge brent fan but he was a great player for sure. i agree with some of the earlier posts about the keys defining different eras...kindof shows how important every instrument is in a band to have that much sway over the sound.

Been trying really hard but having a difficult time getting into Brent. I've been listening to 5-8-77 non-stop for the past month or two so maybe that biases me a bit. I've listened real hard to what Keith is doing and it's always dead on. He was often the only one tacking things down (although his parts were anything but boring), both rhythmically and harmonically, while Jerry, Phil, and Bob were free to tactfully interract and explore. He played piano as primarily a percussion instrument and really held together the whole rhythm section.

On the other hand, Brent played it more as a lead instrument and constantly stepped on toes, and I don't feel he was a very strong rhythmic player. Post-78 I felt like they lost a lot of their strong collective rhythmic direction they had as a band earlier. Also, during jams, he tended to senselessly blur tonalities. His voice leading is definitely really unique, but I think it never worked well with the tone that he used, being so much in the foreground. The other thing is that Bob's playing got soooooo smokin past about 75 and brent tended to trample on the parts of the beat Bob lived in and I don't feel he ever came through the same way after that. If someone can tell me a specific show to make me eat my words on all that I'd love to hear it, as I've definitely be far listened to more 70s dead than any other era and wish I could get into more of the later stuff.

Is it working out that everyone is going with the one they saw first or most? All my shows were 85-91 so Brent is the man for me.
Jerry moved across the stage when Brent joined and he seemed to communicate and look/smile at Brent more than the others. Not to mention the keys in the JGB were also the B3 like Brent favored. Keith was great, just different than Brent. Vince, while being a great keyboard player, always sounded like he was on a $99 casio.
Did anyone in the band ever express a preference?

warrenMFKNhaynes wrote:I think the results of this post i did kind of says that the 80's was there prime decade.

agree/disagree?

Well, it sure wouldn't be the '90s!

I doubt many serious GD fans would argue that the period starting from when Jerry came back from the coma ('87 sometime? I forget) and ending with Brent's death was a high point for the band. They had had other high points along the way too, but that period was definitely one of them.

I think the band was better with Kieth
I think the most talented keyboardist/singer/songerwriter was Brent
I think the best stageman was Pigpen
I think the best compensator for what the band lacked was Vince
I think the most magical and strongest guru for new improv heights was TC

strumminsix wrote:I think the band was better with Kieth
I think the most talented keyboardist/singer/songerwriter was Brent
I think the best stageman was Pigpen
I think the best compensator for what the band lacked was Vince
I think the most magical and strongest guru for new improv heights was TC

+1

I think the band was better at various times with Brent, Keith and TC (more consistently so during Tom's stint, partly by virtue of it's brevity.)
I think the band was also worse at various times of Brent's, Vince's and Keith's stints.
I think the most talented singer was a toss up between Brent and Pig.
I think the most talented songwriter was Brent.
I think the best stageman was Pigpen, natch.
I think the best compensator for what the band lacked (when he arrived) was Brent.
I think the most magical and strongest guru for new improv heights was Keith '71-'74, not so much post-hiatus.

btw Bruce Hornsby played in the band longer than TC did.

Stevo123 wrote:Brent played it more as a lead instrument and constantly stepped on toes, and I don't feel he was a very strong rhythmic player. Post-78 I felt like they lost a lot of their strong collective rhythmic direction they had as a band earlier. Also, during jams, he tended to senselessly blur tonalities. His voice leading is definitely really unique, but I think it never worked well with the tone that he used, being so much in the foreground. If someone can tell me a specific show to make me eat my words on all that I'd love to hear it, as I've definitely be far listened to more 70s dead than any other era and wish I could get into more of the later stuff.

2/27/81 II is a great place to start your journey of Mydland appreciation, particularly S>F and NFA>Wharf Rat

Bobby is actually the guy who recruited Brent, out of the Bob Weir Band.

confusions_prince wrote:

strumminsix wrote:I think the band was better with Kieth
I think the most talented keyboardist/singer/songerwriter was Brent
I think the best stageman was Pigpen
I think the best compensator for what the band lacked was Vince
I think the most magical and strongest guru for new improv heights was TC

+1

Gotta agree with the assessments.

But favorite... it is not on the list... with Keith on piano and Pig on organ. Always loved having both sounds in the mix. More fabric to punch through I know but the sound was great during that period, Europe '72, those brief times when that was the configuration. (I can't name the time interval).

Brent was the best overall keys player in the broad sense... he played many different ones and all with a high degree of technical ability. However, because of that, I always felt Bobby faded back into the mix. Like he dropped doing the China Cat part and left it to Brent mostly. In a lot of shows of that era, I can't hardly pick him out.

So I go with the dual keys . Gave the band more options, though it wasn't an option on the original pick list.

Dave

Tigerstrat,

Ok so I dig 2-27-81, really great show. The organ playing is really awesome and I can have an appreciation for that. My only problem is I KNOW Bobby is doing amazing stuff and I have to listen sooooo hard to hear him lol! Guess I'll just have to get over that. Thanks for the recommendation.

Stevo123 wrote:Tigerstrat,

Ok so I dig 2-27-81, really great show. The organ playing is really awesome and I can have an appreciation for that. My only problem is I KNOW Bobby is doing amazing stuff and I have to listen sooooo hard to hear him lol! Guess I'll just have to get over that. Thanks for the recommendation.

Ding! Ding! Ding! Why I don't like most shows post 79! I LOVE BRENT! However, there are lots of 73-78 shows where you hear everybody so clearly in the mix that Brent shows get little love on my home stereo.

Stevo123 wrote:Tigerstrat,

Ok so I dig 2-27-81, really great show. The organ playing is really awesome and I can have an appreciation for that. My only problem is I KNOW Bobby is doing amazing stuff and I have to listen sooooo hard to hear him lol! Guess I'll just have to get over that. Thanks for the recommendation.

At the risk of stating the obvious, I'll just say that Brent has virtually nothing to do with the mix you're hearing on a recording.

warrenMFKNhaynes wrote:I think the results of this post i did kind of says that the 80's was there prime decade.

agree/disagree?

As for the results of the poll implying people think the 80s era is/was their prime decade, I personally loved those years and agree that 87-90 was a peak period, but in large part because I got to see a lot of shows then. I'm guessing if we had an even demographic sample of every decade the results would be a lot different and would likely favor the 60s or the 70s over the 80s....kinda of like "best tapes/best shows/best whatever" always seem to be the ones in the widest circulation.

I can't believe the beating Brent is giving Keith. I know everyone here skips past Tons of Steel....lol