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 #73929  by strumminsix
 Thu Feb 11, 2010 2:26 pm
mkaufman wrote: All-in-all, I've owned many UE400's & UE405's and I've never experienced 'the' sound. The UE700 & AD230 are in a different class all together.
+1

I've owned 1 UE400 and heard plenty of both and never experienced it either. I have, however, with the UE700.
 #73937  by playingdead
 Thu Feb 11, 2010 4:05 pm
Which effects on the 700 give "the sound?"
Last edited by playingdead on Thu Feb 11, 2010 4:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 #73939  by playingdead
 Thu Feb 11, 2010 4:13 pm
If you want, say, the classic Dead Set 1980 Radio City Cowboy tone, what would you use? I feel an AxeFX project coming on.

And, not being very familiar with the Cowboy, what pickup configuration did he typically use in that era?
 #73941  by Laytonco
 Thu Feb 11, 2010 4:29 pm
Hey Vic, please share the results. I once said someone would have to rip tubes from my cold dead hands. But, if you get onto some Weir on that Axe, I might...mmmmight be pursuaded.

Peace,

Gil
 #73943  by strumminsix
 Thu Feb 11, 2010 4:42 pm
playingdead wrote:If you want, say, the classic Dead Set 1980 Radio City Cowboy tone, what would you use? I feel an AxeFX project coming on.

And, not being very familiar with the Cowboy, what pickup configuration did he typically use in that era?

Vic, I'd be much more interested in a Closing of Winterland take on Weir with an Axe. OR maybe classic May of 77!
 #73945  by playingdead
 Thu Feb 11, 2010 4:55 pm
The 78 tone is not far from the 80 tone, actually; one of my favorite Weir tapes is the audience from 1-20-79 at Shea's Theater in Buffalo. That has that same sound to it that I recall from Radio City.

So, some compression, EQ midrange emphasis, and what, a flanger?

It always seemed to me that somehow the flanger or the phaser or whatever wasn't really sweeping, but seemed to be controlled by his attack. Or, at least, I never really heard it sweeping.

I do know that you can take a phaser or flanger in the AxeFX and easily modify it so instead of sweeping it would just stay on the point you choose it in the sweep. Or have it go somewhere in the sweep depending on the envelope.

I'd need some fairly specific information on the preamp and speakers, as well, from that era. I've never researched it. And which guitar to use ... besides the Tiger, I have a Suhr Strat, PRS Custom 22 and a Tele.
 #73955  by mkaufman
 Thu Feb 11, 2010 8:04 pm
To me, Weir's sound in '77, '78, '79 are quite different with '78 being a transition year. Basically, he starts out the year using Ibanez Super 80 pickups one guitar and ends the year using Dimarzio pickups on a different guitar. I also think that starting in 1979, his sound is more 'processed'.

Spring 78:

- Ibanez with very fancy inlay plus Super 80 pickups & middle single coil pickup
- Mesa Boogie amp (I think)
- AD230
- MC2300

Fall 78:
- the true Cowboy (with fancy inlay, yet less fancy than the spring '78 guitar) which supposedly has Dimarzio pickups
- Peavey F800G
- AD230
- UE700
- MC2300

I think for 12/31/78 he used the Boogie and then in '79 the IVP, etc are used.

btw...I found some cool pics I've never seen before:

October '76 - Day on the Green:
Weir has very fancy Ibanez before EQ/Pre-amp was added. This is the same guitar used until fall '78.

Eqypt:
http://www.dead.net/sites/deadbeta.rhin ... 5B1%5D.jpg

More Eqypt here:
http://www.ukrockfestivals.com/egyptph1.htm

Boston '76: JG w/ 2 Boogies.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/__MBlWvx9Cy8/R ... l+band.jpg

Check out phil,weir & the amps!
http://www.dead.net/sites/deadbeta.rhin ... 8_2031.jpg

Lastly - check these out - there are tons of great pics!
http://www.dead.net/archives/photos

mk
 #73970  by strumminsix
 Fri Feb 12, 2010 6:01 am
Vic, this will be cool! Here is where I'd start:

Amp - either a MkI Boogie or maybe the preamp of Deluxe Reverb.
Tonestack - a smidge of bass, lots of highs, enough bass to balance out the tone
EQ - hi pass over 150, lo pass under 9k
comp - just enough to actually get it compressing, no more
flanger (has to be one of the multi-knob models) - medium speed, some regen, med-low fdbk, about a 1/3 mix

Guitar wise I'd go for guitar where you can setup your pickups to parallel

Adding in other FX the Dist on the 700 is like a TS with less mid hump and the Phase is like a P90.
 #73971  by playingdead
 Fri Feb 12, 2010 6:05 am
Cool.

Cliff just came out with an update to the AxeFX that completely reworks all the Fender models, and improves the spring reverb, which was pretty good to begin with.
 #73977  by playingdead
 Fri Feb 12, 2010 7:43 am
This, from dozin's site, seems to confirm what my ears are telling me:

"Bob also uses a Cutler-built custom pedal that remotely controls the electronics on the rack and is a combination phase and wah-wah. He can have it either phasing, wahing, or a mix of the two. When he move the pedal from back to forward, both the wah and phaser go up in tone. Most phasers use an oscillator that sweeps back and forth, but this replaces the oscillator with a footpedal."

At that point he was also playing through 8 10" Gauss speakers with a solid state Godzilla power amp and an IVP preamp.

So, with the right phaser built in the AxeFX, and with the sweep parameter assigned to my expression pedal ... some EQ and compression ... and maybe the custom K110 IR's I have for the AxeFX ...
 #73996  by FretWilkes
 Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:15 am
strumminsix wrote:
playingdead wrote: IVP preamp.
Single worst piece of gear I have ever owned.
Back around 1980 I had one in a rack with a Furman RV-1 Reverb and a Crown DC150A Power Amp pushing two Altec Lansing 12s in HT homebrew cabinet.

I used a Strat with DiMarzio FS-1 pickups and got a great sound. I finally ditched it for a simple Fender combo because the IVP was broken about 50% of the time. Bad solder joints all over the thing.

The first couple of weekes I had that rig with the IVP the only tone I could get was crap! After working with it for some time I got it dialed in and really liked the tone. Very unreliable however, so ...buh bye.
 #74003  by strumminsix
 Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:28 am
FretWilkes wrote:
strumminsix wrote:
playingdead wrote: IVP preamp.
Single worst piece of gear I have ever owned.
Back around 1980 I had one in a rack with a Furman RV-1 Reverb and a Crown DC150A Power Amp pushing two Altec Lansing 12s in HT homebrew cabinet.

I used a Strat with DiMarzio FS-1 pickups and got a great sound. I finally ditched it for a simple Fender combo because the IVP was broken about 50% of the time. Bad solder joints all over the thing.

The first couple of weekes I had that rig with the IVP the only tone I could get was crap! After working with it for some time I got it dialed in and really liked the tone. Very unreliable however, so ...buh bye.
That seems to be the consensus - spend more time tweaking than actually playing :lol:
 #74011  by jeffm725
 Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:22 am
playingdead wrote:This, from dozin's site, seems to confirm what my ears are telling me:

"Bob also uses a Cutler-built custom pedal that remotely controls the electronics on the rack and is a combination phase and wah-wah. He can have it either phasing, wahing, or a mix of the two. When he move the pedal from back to forward, both the wah and phaser go up in tone. Most phasers use an oscillator that sweeps back and forth, but this replaces the oscillator with a footpedal."

At that point he was also playing through 8 10" Gauss speakers with a solid state Godzilla power amp and an IVP preamp.

So, with the right phaser built in the AxeFX, and with the sweep parameter assigned to my expression pedal ... some EQ and compression ... and maybe the custom K110 IR's I have for the AxeFX ...
The female singer in my JGB project is friends with Cutler, and I asked him if he had a schematic for that custom Phase/Wah he built for Weir. He was kind of elusive about it, but he remembered it and mentioned that he was thinking about getting into the boutique effects building game and that would be one of his offerings.
It would be great if he did.
That pedal was a key component of Weir's mid 80's rig.........I remember being front row in Hamptom in either 86 or 87 one night when they did Althea and Weir's foot was on that rocker pedal for the whole song. So if anyone is wondering what that pedal sounds like (at least in one fashion, because I believe it was VERY versatile) listen to Althea's from the aforementioned period.