rukind.com

Grateful Dead Music Forum

A place to talk about the music of the Grateful Dead 

 #65969  by Tennessee Jedi
 Fri Sep 18, 2009 7:09 am
Hey hey '12
You are coming from the bass side of the the tune; maybe one of the bass guys has some insight ....
I do like to follow E 72 version Mi Amigo
Some times I run into guys who dont hold the E long enough after the Jerry riff ( as in E 72 )
I have no clue as to what Phil does.
Great to have you on board '12
:D
 #65972  by strumminsix
 Fri Sep 18, 2009 8:10 am
glocke12 wrote:haha...good point. I guess the Europe 72 version would be good to start with.
Cool! I have that album and a guitar handy but now what time should I start listening at for the "bridge"?

And are we talking Bobby, Jerry or Phil here?
 #65973  by Tennessee Jedi
 Fri Sep 18, 2009 8:12 am
strumminsix wrote:
glocke12 wrote:haha...good point. I guess the Europe 72 version would be good to start with.
Cool! I have that album and a guitar handy but now what time should I start listening at for the "bridge"?

And are we talking Bobby, Jerry or Phil here?
Phil - he's a bass dude...
:D
 #65978  by tigerstrat
 Fri Sep 18, 2009 8:25 am
Hundreds of shows, but no official releases in my possession. However I can't imagine E72 would be structurally different than most others.

It's simply modulating the entire progression (Verse, "I" lead break, "V" lead break) from G mixo to E mixo and back, with the return modulation occurring on the last chord of the turnaround (A -> D!). Most (if not all) times, you'll notice Phil pretty much taking over the lead for the duration of the "V" break. hth
 #65982  by glocke12
 Fri Sep 18, 2009 8:43 am
Well, this is what Ive come up with. This is root motion only, for phil. I know theres alot of other things happening in that section of music , but Im Im just focusing on the fundamental.

If you start listening at 2:05 and end at 2:40 this is what I think I am hearing..

C/D/E/E/
E/B-D/E/E
D/D/E/E/E
B-D/E/E/D
E for nine measures and than on the tenth measure is the transition to
B.
 #66049  by Rusty the Scoob
 Sun Sep 20, 2009 8:33 am
Welcome to the forum! :cool: The more bassists the better! :cheers:

A band member in my (former? Current?) side band made a great chart - I made a couple of minor corrections, and here it is.
China Cat Sunflower: Chord Chart

Verse 1:
[G / / /] [G / F /] [G / / / ] [F / / / ]
[G / / /] [G / F /] [G / / / ] [F / / / ]

Little Lead between:
[G / / / ] [G / / / ] [G / / / ] [G / / / ]
[D / / / ] [D / / / ] [D / / / ] [D / C / ] [D /]

Verse 2:
[G / / /] [G / F /] [G / / / ] [F / / / ]
[G / / /] [G / F /] [G / / / ] [F / / / ]

2nd (identical) little Lead between:
[G / / / ] [G / / / ] [G / / / ] [G / / / ]
[D / / / ] [D / / / ] [D / / / ] [D / C / ] [D /]

Bridge:
[E / / / ] [E / / / ] [E / / / ] [D / E / ]
[E / / / ] [E / / / ] [E / / / ] [D / E / ]
[E / / / ] [E / / / ] [E / / / ] [D / E / ]
[B / / / ] [B / / / ] [B / / / ] [B / A / ] [D /]

Verse 3:
[G / / /] [G / F /] [G / / / ] [F / / / ]
[G / / /] [G / F /] [G / / / ] [F / / / ]

Transition Lead:
[G / / / ] [G / / / ] [G / / / ] [G / / / ]
[D / / / ] etc etc jam on D into Rider
I believe this structure was set in stone from the 60s to the 90s but I haven't sat down and counted how long they hold the E on different versions. I tend to hit a bomb on that first E and hold it, sometimes until the D after it, then start jamming the progression above. It's another way to create tension and release. A good example of my approach can be heard here: http://www.archive.org/details/Fennario ... ir.Anzelmo

I've heard some debate from time to time about the last chord at the end of the bridge and before the 3rd verse. I firmly believe that it's a D - it sounds right to my ears and makes perfect sense with music theory - it's the V in a classic "II V I" transition back to G.
 #66052  by tigerstrat
 Sun Sep 20, 2009 9:38 am
Rusty the Scoob wrote:I've heard some debate from time to time about the last chord at the end of the bridge and before the 3rd verse. I firmly believe that it's a D - it sounds right to my ears and makes perfect sense with music theory - it's the V in a classic "II V I" transition back to G.
Rusty, I'm totally with you that it's D, but what other chord do differing opinions say it is?

Which show is the E72 CCat from, anyway? All these references to albums and DP's totally befuddles me. Talk dates, people!!
Last edited by tigerstrat on Sun Sep 20, 2009 12:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 #66056  by BuddhaG
 Sun Sep 20, 2009 11:44 am
E72 is sped up a 1/2 step... so you might have trouble working with it to figure out what's going on... unless you want to tune up...
 #66057  by tigerstrat
 Sun Sep 20, 2009 12:15 pm
To answer my own question it's from May 3, 1972 at Olympia Theatre, Paris
 #66073  by Rusty the Scoob
 Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:17 am
tigerstrat wrote:
Rusty the Scoob wrote:I've heard some debate from time to time about the last chord at the end of the bridge and before the 3rd verse. I firmly believe that it's a D - it sounds right to my ears and makes perfect sense with music theory - it's the V in a classic "II V I" transition back to G.
Rusty, I'm totally with you that it's D, but what other chord do differing opinions say it is?

Which show is the E72 CCat from, anyway? All these references to albums and DP's totally befuddles me. Talk dates, people!!

Some people play C or B, I think. Not positive.
 #120958  by Tennessee Jedi
 Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:14 pm
tigerstrat wrote:
Rusty the Scoob wrote:I've heard some debate from time to time about the last chord at the end of the bridge and before the 3rd verse. I firmly believe that it's a D - it sounds right to my ears and makes perfect sense with music theory - it's the V in a classic "II V I" transition back to G.
Rusty, I'm totally with you that it's D, but what other chord do differing opinions say it is?

Which show is the E72 CCat from, anyway? All these references to albums and DP's totally befuddles me. Talk dates, people!!
interesting ...... the D sounds good ..... always did B-> A to end it
 #120959  by tcsned
 Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:25 pm
D is what I've always done. It's the 5th of G and resolves to the G for the last verse. If we're talking about the last two measures of the bridge - B/A/ | D /