Grateful Dead Music Forum

A place to talk about the music of the Grateful Dead 

 #125687  by Smolder
 Sun Mar 17, 2013 2:37 pm
Anyone had any success nailing the tone with a smaller amp?

I'm mostly in a low volume situation and the princeton with a K110 isn't really mailing it (as BradS predicted). I'm thinking of building a 1x12 grab and go low volume amp. It would be an ab763 single channel circuit with no term, but using a DYI reverb pedal in the amp. I may build it to accommodate 5881's as well as 6V6's. 15-18 watts at about half volume oughta work.

Any thoughts?
 #125871  by Jon S.
 Mon Mar 18, 2013 6:08 am
I recommend JJ 6V6s - they are lower power but more 6L6-ish tonewise. I think they'd work well for someone seeking Jerry tones from a 6V6 rig.
 #125873  by Smolder
 Mon Mar 18, 2013 6:23 am
Just grabbed an old princeton cabinet off of a forum. I think I'll put a bf style baffle structure in it and a 12" baffle for a D120 and see how this rolls. If my princeton NR or reverb aren't enough, then I'll buy an empty chassis and do a single channel deluxe build. I'll let you'll know how it goes.
 #125923  by Smolder
 Wed Mar 20, 2013 9:40 am
I found an empty silverface princeton cab for cheap. Gonna mod it for a blackface style 1x12 baffle and use a D120. Gonna buy a mojo chassis and build a 1 channel deluxe reverb with Jerry mods... minus the tremolo. Still thinking about putting a (BYOB reverb circuit in it). It will likely be V, T, M, B, bright switch and maybe a RAW control. I think I have all of the parts except for the chassis.
 #125925  by mgbills
 Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:58 am
I love my Deluxe Reverb with a D120.

Mr. Sarno recommended a tone stack that's simply awesome. The JBL keeps it from getting to "Cream 6V6" too quickly. The JBL makes it HEAVY. Feels almost like a non-JBL twin. That said....I love it. Tons of character. Like early '70's Jerry in a smaller box. I went NOS with some cool RCA 12AX7's & 6V6's. Not the cheap route. One of my NOS power tubes came flawed, and it cost me 2 rectifier tubes.

Live & learn.
I think you'll really like your project when it's done.

 #125927  by Smolder
 Wed Mar 20, 2013 12:45 pm
Thanks M...

The weight is partially why I'm using the princeton form factor (and a single channel). I am making a sonic compromise putting that JBL in such a small cab... hopefully not to much. I'm going to try a straight princeton with a jbl at a gig coming up soon... but I'm thinking that an extra 6-8 watts will give me optimal headroom for situations where taking the SMS/mc50 doesn't make sense.
 #126066  by jackevorkian
 Mon Mar 25, 2013 6:35 pm
I put an orange frame D120F in a Headstrong Lil King, and couldn't get it out of there fast enough. Super nasally...I just don't think that a 12" JBL in a Princeton size cab is ideal. I ended up with a ceramic Tone Tubby, and the amp really sounded like a little Twin. I eventually sold the amp, but recently picked up a PRRI. After plying it for a few months stock, I made a 12" baffle, but realized pretty quickly that the 10", for me, sounds perfect with that circuit/in that cab. So, now I'm looking around for an E110 or maybe a Weber Cali, or possibly even a Gold. I'm just wanting super clear and extended frequency, but not necessarily JG. I also use a 15" extension cab with the Princeton sometimes that sounds huge. The 10" plus an extension cab is very full for a small amp.

I just discovered Milkman Sound Amps. He makes a 20 watt Princeton type amp that is very heavily Twin inspired, as he builds mostly pedal steel amps. It's expensive, but I'll bet it would be great for a lower wattage JG tone. Also, the Allen Sweet Spot is a beefed up Princeton that can take 6L6's...most seem to find it much more articulate than the average Princeton. He sells them as a kit option that is not too expensive.
 #126067  by Smolder
 Mon Mar 25, 2013 8:05 pm
Thanks jack... the milkman sounds interesting. I have a PR with a D110 and a P NR with a K110. Those speakers don't quite nail the jerry thing. fwiw I tried the weber neo mag 10 in the PR and talk about nasely... yikes. Sounds great paired with a weber cali in the vibrolux though.

Back to the project... I found an empty princeton cab in fairly good shape. I pulled the dato'd baffle and put in 1/2x1.5 inch trim and made a baffle for the D120. I'm building the single channel deluxe (that will take 6L6's) in the next week or two, but in the meantime put the princeton NR in it. It sounds really good, but has a bit too much bass response even with the bass on 0. The Princeton NR doesn't really break up... it's very clean, which is how I'll set up the deluxe. I'm using the ams/mc50/e120 as a reference point.

The chassis and a couple of minor parts get here tomorrow... I'll be putting it together soon, but work and gigs are frankly kicking my ass right now.
 #126075  by jackevorkian
 Tue Mar 26, 2013 6:24 am
Do you prefer the K110 or the D110 in the Princeton? I'm really interested in the E...I seem to almost always prefer a ceramic mag for lower volume clean tones, with the exception of a Blue in a tweed Deluxe (which is why I'm also curious about a Gold).
 #126081  by Smolder
 Tue Mar 26, 2013 8:35 am
jackevorkian wrote:Do you prefer the K110 or the D110 in the Princeton? I'm really interested in the E...I seem to almost always prefer a ceramic mag for lower volume clean tones, with the exception of a Blue in a tweed Deluxe (which is why I'm also curious about a Gold).
I have three E120's and 2 E110's... I've moved all of them to wedges for PA use. I much prefer the K and D speakers for guitar. They are sweeter and more musical to my ears. And... I don't really need 300 watts of power handling... ever. I can't really give a preference between the K110 and the D110, and these are the only two I have (small sampling)... plus, I think my D is tired. That original paper cone is pretty old at this point. It's a bit more mellow and the K is slightly brighter and sounds a bit more accurate, but I'm really splitting hairs here. If I were looking for another I'd go K as it is a stronger paper cone (and newer) and the difference in tone is really slight.
 #126151  by waldo041
 Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:25 am
i have used a deluxe ab763 sized combo i made for many years, a few suggestions on the subject of headroom with your project.

1.) use a solid state rectifier vs. a tube rectifier.

2.) get a good power transformer capable of handling more current then 6v6's.

3.) this coincides with #2, consider using kt66's for more headroom if needed/wanted.

The 6l6's can get dirty faster then you might think.