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Chat about Equipment Info
 #115893  by Mosfed
 Tue Jul 10, 2012 4:39 pm
Hey there

So I am looking to buy a Fender amp, preferably blackface or silverface. Naturally the ideal is a Fender Twin. Especially with the various Garcia mods and the pair of JBL D-120/ I have .

My issue is that a Twin is just too loud. So yes I know you can drop two of the main output tubes to lower the wattage but I have heard that they are still loud as all hell.

So the dilemma becomes what will get me closer to that Garcia Sound:

- a Twin minus 2 tubes with A really quality attenuator like a Thd hot plate
Or
- a pro or deluxe reverb

Does anyone have experience with the same issue? What did you do? Experience with attenuators?

THANKS
 #115895  by NSP
 Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:01 pm
I had a THD hotplate a long time ago that I used with a Mesa DC-5. I found it to be a tone sucker....in my case it wasn't the answer. I think you'd be better off with a Deluxe or Pro. my 0.02.
 #115896  by dleonard
 Tue Jul 10, 2012 5:10 pm
yeah...way better off with the Deluxe then going the attenuator route. I sold my Twin bc its too loud. I was thinking of maybe even getting a Blues junior, but fear that may be too quiet with a drummer
 #115902  by waldo041
 Tue Jul 10, 2012 6:05 pm
keep the twin, and put a master volume on it. a 250k audio pot inbetween the phase inverter, and 220k mix nodes should work just fine.

putting in a preamp tap and going with a mac solid state power amp is by far the better option with way more volume control.

~waldo
 #115908  by Mosfed
 Wed Jul 11, 2012 4:36 am
dleonard wrote:yeah...way better off with the Deluxe then going the attenuator route. I sold my Twin bc its too loud. I was thinking of maybe even getting a Blues junior, but fear that may be too quiet with a drummer
I've got a Blues Deluxe now that is a fantastic amp. I want to get a little closer to the Garcia sound hense the issue - but it is a great amp. Plenty loud for a drummer. I had a Blues Junior and it wasn't enough. Not far off but it just couldn't go to 11...
 #115909  by Mosfed
 Wed Jul 11, 2012 4:38 am
waldo041 wrote:keep the twin, and put a master volume on it. a 250k audio pot inbetween the phase inverter, and 220k mix nodes should work just fine.

putting in a preamp tap and going with a mac solid state power amp is by far the better option with way more volume control.

~waldo
Thanks mate. Trying to go one step at a time... But I am clear that an MC-50 or similar is in my future...
 #115911  by gpilcher2001
 Wed Jul 11, 2012 5:06 am
I have used a hot plate with good results. The bright and deep switches are very important once you go belw 8db's of attenuation. It did sound its best on the 4 and 8 db settings. All you achieve with the pulling tubes is a 3 db drop in volume anyways. 1/2 ing the power on a tube amp only gets you that. There are other brands of attenuaters out there that are a little more flexible than the hot plate. Weber has a whole slew of them. Dr. Z has one that goes in, i think 2 db icrements, thats really transparent. My problem with the hot plate was not enough fine tuning. It was either to loud or not to loud no middle ground. Sonically it was great. If you could find a super reverb head, which i think is a band master, I'm sure someone here can correct me, that would put you in an ab763 fender circuit at 40 or 50 watts that can be modded for jerry. Thats plenty of power and headroom for just about any gig your likley to play. Greg...
 #115941  by Mosfed
 Wed Jul 11, 2012 4:14 pm
gpilcher2001 wrote:I have used a hot plate with good results. The bright and deep switches are very important once you go belw 8db's of attenuation. It did sound its best on the 4 and 8 db settings. All you achieve with the pulling tubes is a 3 db drop in volume anyways. 1/2 ing the power on a tube amp only gets you that. There are other brands of attenuaters out there that are a little more flexible than the hot plate. Weber has a whole slew of them. Dr. Z has one that goes in, i think 2 db icrements, thats really transparent. My problem with the hot plate was not enough fine tuning. It was either to loud or not to loud no middle ground. Sonically it was great. If you could find a super reverb head, which i think is a band master, I'm sure someone here can correct me, that would put you in an ab763 fender circuit at 40 or 50 watts that can be modded for jerry. Thats plenty of power and headroom for just about any gig your likley to play. Greg...
Lots of great info! Figuring out which head (if the Bandmaster is the call then so be it) really is the Holy grail of my question. Because if I could spend my money in two parts rather than three - so now purchase the cab and the head and then add an amp in the future - that would be literally perfect. Is the Bandmaster the head I am seeking? Twin like pre amp circuit that can be modded with 40 or so watts of juice?

Thanks mate!
 #115944  by Mosfed
 Wed Jul 11, 2012 4:37 pm
Ok - so I just saw that my JBL D-120 s are 8 ohm speakers and heads like the Fender Bandmaster are 4ohm heads. Am I shit out of luck or is there a work around?
 #115945  by Smolder
 Wed Jul 11, 2012 4:52 pm
Mosfed wrote:Ok - so I just saw that my JBL D-120 s are 8 ohm speakers and heads like the Fender Bandmaster are 4ohm heads. Am I shit out of luck or is there a work around?
your bandmaster can handle that mismatch just fine.

The impedance output of a transformer is not a constant. It is essential an aggregate number. Speakers are paired on that number so they can accommodate a range. Leo put a four ohm load in a bandmaster to match up with two eight ohm speakers wired in parallel in a 4 ohm bandmaster cabinet. But... he also put to jacks in parallel knowing that you might want to have two bandmaster cabs. Not all amps are built with the same sturdiness... but it's general considered safe to double, or half the load on a fender amp.
 #115962  by tigerstrat
 Wed Jul 11, 2012 10:54 pm
Smolder wrote:
Mosfed wrote:Ok - so I just saw that my JBL D-120 s are 8 ohm speakers and heads like the Fender Bandmaster are 4ohm heads. Am I shit out of luck or is there a work around?
your bandmaster can handle that mismatch just fine.

The impedance output of a transformer is not a constant. It is essential an aggregate number. Speakers are paired on that number so they can accommodate a range. Leo put a four ohm load in a bandmaster to match up with two eight ohm speakers wired in parallel in a 4 ohm bandmaster cabinet. But... he also put to jacks in parallel knowing that you might want to have two bandmaster cabs. Not all amps are built with the same sturdiness... but it's general considered safe to double, or half the load on a fender amp.
IOW there is no mismatch at all with driving the two 8ohm D-120's (in parallel, a 4ohm load) with the Bandmaster, which ideally sees a 4ohm load.
 #115965  by gpilcher2001
 Thu Jul 12, 2012 5:08 am
The best way imop to get a 40 watt version of a twin is to go to webers site and purchase the 6a40 kit in the head version and get someone to build it for you. You could then have all the mods included in the build. Then you have an amp that is versitile enough to be used as an amp or preamp shojld you choose to go the route of the mac later on. Of course that would depend on how much coin you have. But you should be able to get it done for th same amount of money as buying a vintage amp. Greg...