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 #103226  by Capt Rosebuddy
 Mon Sep 12, 2011 8:39 am
With the exception of the Jerry's fabulous wah usage in the pre hiatus period, is the Slipknot! jam on 8/13/75 the first appearance of an effect pedal in Jerry's playing?
If this info is already available on the forum forgive me, and advance thanks.
 #103229  by Capt Rosebuddy
 Mon Sep 12, 2011 9:16 am
After consulting Deadbase, it turns out that 6/17/75 was the first appearance (technically) of Help>Slip>Frank, but, Help is decidedly incomplete, no lyrics that is and the into is a little different. Seems more like a public fleshing out of the song structure to me. I say the Great American Music Hall version is the true first.

either way have a listen:
http://www.archive.org/details/gd1975-0 ... 465.flac16

I can't believe I'm even saying this but Keith's Rhodes playing is Killer! very Don Fagen(esque). Also Jerry's tone is clean throughout.
 #103243  by tigerstrat
 Mon Sep 12, 2011 12:57 pm
According to Healy, it was a device called "Insect Fear", long about 1969. I couldn't get him to give me any useful details about it, but he said it was made by Roland... good luck in your search! :roll:
 #103251  by Cmnaround
 Mon Sep 12, 2011 1:26 pm
Capt Rosebuddy wrote:After consulting Deadbase, it turns out that 6/17/75 was the first appearance (technically) of Help>Slip>Frank, but, Help is decidedly incomplete, no lyrics that is and the into is a little different. Seems more like a public fleshing out of the song structure to me. I say the Great American Music Hall version is the true first.
Ah, I must respectfully disagree as I had a chance to download and study in some detial the 6/17/75 show a few months back. I was really interested in what was happening during that period, and how the various jams were shaping up relative to what happened in 1974 and then post hiatus in 1976.

That show has a nice peggy o in 1st set, in addition to the perhaps unexpected but amazingly beautiful help>slip>franklins. You are indeed correct that there are no lyrics in the help on the way, but the song structure, verse/chorus timing is spot on, with Jerry laying out in guitar voice what the lyrics would soon be.

I was just curious to hear the first public version of Franklins, and was wondering if that was a complete surprise to those in the audience, or if many had already heard some version prior to the 6/17/75 show from any rehearsal tapes that may have been leaked out. Or if the slipknot jam had not quite been pushed yet in any extended jams in 1974 leading up to this show. I mean seriously, to be at a show and hear the first Franlins ever - what a rush. Especially if no one was used to the quirky and trippy help>slipknot jam, just an incredible build of tension over and over and over until that final sweet resolution into Franklins - and a complete naive experience for all - must have been just totally mind blowing.

I highly recommend the audience version since you can hear the swells of the crowd as the journey kicks off and builds throughout - and at the end you can clearly hear an excited couple giggling and saying "Change the batteries!!" Thanks to those who taped this back in the day - and if anyone can point me to any jams in 1974 where the slipknot jam started to evolve, that would be most appreciated.
 #103252  by Pete B.
 Mon Sep 12, 2011 1:37 pm
Cmnaround wrote: ...if anyone can point me to any jams in 1974 where the slipknot jam started to evolve, that would be most appreciated.
fwiw, The part of the Slipknot jam typically reffered to as "The Whip" can be heard in other songs (and/or between song noodling) as early as 1972.
 #103274  by tigerstrat
 Mon Sep 12, 2011 4:18 pm
This was Cap'n R's "First FX box?" thread... :x .

I did a little reading on Roland's history and turns out they didn't even become Roland until 1972. Before that, Mr. Kakahashi and Co. were releasing various effects under the name "Ace Tone". I'd love to know what the EXP-4 Expander does:http://www.effectsdatabase.com/model/acetone/exp4
 #103281  by Pete B.
 Mon Sep 12, 2011 5:05 pm
tigerstrat wrote:This was Cap'n R's "First FX box?" thread... :x .
Good luck with that, Bud! :wink:

fwiw, Jerry was credited with "Insect Fear" on an early Jefferson Airplane album... "Blows Against the Empire" I think.

[Edit]
Looks like it was "Rolling Thunder" (1972).
See Garcias credit for "Pump Song".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_Thunder_(album)
Album image:
http://www.proaudioinfo.com/disk-market ... 01052c.jpg
 #103293  by Capt Rosebuddy
 Mon Sep 12, 2011 6:54 pm
Frankly I don't think it's all that daunting of a task to pin down where and when the effects first appeared. I probably should have been more precise, it seems like that slipknot! is the first (live) appearance of an MXR sounding distortion box. I remember a thread going back in '09 about the '76 NYE show and the MuTron I think but can't remember what it was in reference to, or what the thread was about.

Also, a little background, I re read in the spring time The Long Strange Trip, and Mcknally really makes it sound like it was one continues line of consciousness from the Blues for Allah album through the Great American gig (which was really a family party to debut the new material) to the "middle eastern vibe" that they where into in the mid 70's that culminated with the Egypt shows in '78. Anyway it got me listening to that show a lot all summer and got to thinking about the new direction the band took really, at that gig. I can't recommend that book enough, absolutely required reading for anybody into that thing called the GD.

So that effect he's using in "The Pump" song is that Roland box? pretty cool sounding whatever it was..
Oh well it's always a hoot probing the knowledge base here.
 #103328  by tigerstrat
 Tue Sep 13, 2011 7:33 am
I don't believe it's yet been proven that a product called "Insect Fear" ever actually existed!

I could be misremembering the Roland bit too. I was just reaching the end of DH's patience with this line of questioning... the only reference to be found about it online is an excerpt from R.Scully's Living With The Dead

I'm just pretty sure there is an effect of some sort in play during the early '69 Dark Stars, possibly the Stephen bridges too.
 #103335  by Pete B.
 Tue Sep 13, 2011 8:25 am
tigerstrat wrote:I don't believe it's yet been proven that a product called "Insect Fear" ever actually existed!
I'm guessing The GD members and friends were probably fans of the "Insect Fear" comic book.
 #103336  by Tennessee Jedi
 Tue Sep 13, 2011 8:39 am
Sounds like a phaser type pedal on the 03/26/73 Baltimore solo on 'Candyman'. Maybe its just the wah being rocked fast but sounds like it has some phase on it
Before the tune starts I can hear ( I think ) Jerry checking the phaser level a bit ....
I cant figure out to post a link to the show on the Archive
:?:
 #103337  by foolofships
 Tue Sep 13, 2011 8:50 am
I would speculate that other than the wah, Jerry didn't use effects boxes at all until after the OBEL, which would put the first use after the comeback. I read a snippet of interview (I believe it was in the GD Gear book) where he talked about not liking how inconsistently effects sound live, until he came up with the OBEL. Of course, the flaw in my speculation is how would he know that he doesn't like to use effects live unless he used them a couple times. :roll:
 #103340  by strumminsix
 Tue Sep 13, 2011 9:02 am
Didn't JG use a Colortone Volume/Wah combo that would sound like a Wah and drive the front of the amp into distortion at the same time?