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 #99747  by strumminsix
 Tue Jun 21, 2011 9:36 am
SarnoMusicSolutions wrote:
strumminsix wrote:Brad, do you think this would work ok:
SMS > DI box with speaker emulation > XLR out to SBD | 1/4" out to poweramp?

Yeah, but why? If you're gonna have a power amp and speaker, why on earth choose the DI over the miked speaker? I'm a BIG advocate of the notion that a guitar speaker is absolutely part of the instrument and going direct has no benefit. Sure that's a generalization because for bass and even pedal steel guitar, DI often works if the preamp is sweet. But for 6-string electric guitar, unless you're doing something like Vic with very high quality digital DSP speaker modeling, going direct, even with those DI box speaker emulators, is gonna pale in comparison to the sound of a real speaker with a real magnet and a real voice coil moving real air into a well placed real microphone. I still believe it's hard to top the real thing. A miked speaker is still the benchmark. Everything else is an attempt to fake that sound. The speaker is a major contributor of dynamic and harmonic and musical characteristics. It's why guitarists have spent over half a century fussing over the right speaker for their tone. The way a real speaker naturally removes the unwanted highs, the way its mass dynamically compresses unwanted transients, the way the resonant characteristics of the cone and dustcap bring out the best of the guitar, etc. That's stuff that the electronic DI speaker emulation circuits can't do.
Why? Because it was an option for mk asking, "Can I go direct to the board and use a poweramp to my speaker cab simultaneously."

Also would work for situations where it's a NO AMP situation. Been there before. Or maybe someone would like the 2. Dunno, options is what we are all about, yes?
 #99751  by strumminsix
 Tue Jun 21, 2011 11:37 am
strumminsix wrote:
SarnoMusicSolutions wrote:
strumminsix wrote:Brad, do you think this would work ok:
SMS > DI box with speaker emulation > XLR out to SBD | 1/4" out to poweramp?

Yeah, but why? If you're gonna have a power amp and speaker, why on earth choose the DI over the miked speaker? I'm a BIG advocate of the notion that a guitar speaker is absolutely part of the instrument and going direct has no benefit. Sure that's a generalization because for bass and even pedal steel guitar, DI often works if the preamp is sweet. But for 6-string electric guitar, unless you're doing something like Vic with very high quality digital DSP speaker modeling, going direct, even with those DI box speaker emulators, is gonna pale in comparison to the sound of a real speaker with a real magnet and a real voice coil moving real air into a well placed real microphone. I still believe it's hard to top the real thing. A miked speaker is still the benchmark. Everything else is an attempt to fake that sound. The speaker is a major contributor of dynamic and harmonic and musical characteristics. It's why guitarists have spent over half a century fussing over the right speaker for their tone. The way a real speaker naturally removes the unwanted highs, the way its mass dynamically compresses unwanted transients, the way the resonant characteristics of the cone and dustcap bring out the best of the guitar, etc. That's stuff that the electronic DI speaker emulation circuits can't do.
Why? Because it was an option for mk asking, "Can I go direct to the board and use a poweramp to my speaker cab simultaneously."

Also would work for situations where it's a NO AMP situation. Been there before. Or maybe someone would like the 2. Dunno, options is what we are all about, yes?
And I'm guess, Brad, some of this has to do with :
http://community.rukind.com/viewtopic.p ... =30#p99749
 #99992  by hippieguy1954
 Sat Jun 25, 2011 6:22 am
SMS Classic >Y cable > Rocktron V300 stereo inputs > one channel one output to 2X12 E120's (wired parallel) at 4 ohms at 150 watts and one channel two output to 2X12 (wired parallel) at 4 ohms at 150 watts.

OR

SMS Classic > straight cable > Rocktron V300 mono input (bridged) > outputs > one to each 8 ohm E120 at 8 ohms at 300 watts.

I think this is the bottom line according to the manual. If anyone thinks there is a better way or if I got it all wrong IMO, I'm all ears!
 #100002  by SarnoMusicSolutions
 Sat Jun 25, 2011 11:56 am
hippieguy1954 wrote:SMS Classic >Y cable > Rocktron V300 stereo inputs > one channel one output to 2X12 E120's (wired parallel) at 4 ohms at 150 watts and one channel two output to 2X12 (wired parallel) at 4 ohms at 150 watts.

OR

SMS Classic > straight cable > Rocktron V300 mono input (bridged) > outputs > one to each 8 ohm E120 at 8 ohms at 300 watts.

I think this is the bottom line according to the manual. If anyone thinks there is a better way or if I got it all wrong IMO, I'm all ears!

I believe the end result is identical. Either the Y-cable is summing the two connections, or the input jack on the Rocktron is doing it. Either way, the signal is y-split to both sides of the Rocktron. I guess the simpler way with the single cable makes more sense.

B
 #100008  by hippieguy1954
 Sat Jun 25, 2011 12:46 pm
SarnoMusicSolutions wrote:
hippieguy1954 wrote:SMS Classic >Y cable > Rocktron V300 stereo inputs > one channel one output to 2X12 E120's (wired parallel) at 4 ohms at 150 watts and one channel two output to 2X12 (wired parallel) at 4 ohms at 150 watts.

OR

SMS Classic > straight cable > Rocktron V300 mono input (bridged) > outputs > one to each 8 ohm E120 at 8 ohms at 300 watts.

I think this is the bottom line according to the manual. If anyone thinks there is a better way or if I got it all wrong IMO, I'm all ears!

I believe the end result is identical. Either the Y-cable is summing the two connections, or the input jack on the Rocktron is doing it. Either way, the signal is y-split to both sides of the Rocktron. I guess the simpler way with the single cable makes more sense.

B
I'm glad you agree! Stuff gets a little confusing. The only difference is with the Y cable to the 2 sides allows you to use (4) 8ohm E120's (if ya need/want that) and the straight cable bridging only allows for (2) 8 ohm E120's. I guess it just comes down to personal preference as to how many speaker you want to use.
 #101852  by Bear62
 Tue Aug 02, 2011 8:50 pm
Received my SMS today. What a great sounding preamp. Running into a Tubeworks MV962 powering a SSP 2x12 w/ 16 ohm Weber Neomags in parallel at 8 ohms. Loud as I will ever need! Sounds great w/ my Gretsch White Falcon and my Tele thinline! Thanks everyone for all the input. I have no affiliation w/ any of these vendors other than being a totally satisfied customer! BTW- Loves my fulldrive 2 pedal too!

Gregg
 #101862  by hippieguy1954
 Wed Aug 03, 2011 5:16 am
Bear62 wrote:Received my SMS today. What a great sounding preamp. Running into a Tubeworks MV962 powering a SSP 2x12 w/ 16 ohm Weber Neomags in parallel at 8 ohms. Loud as I will ever need! Sounds great w/ my Gretsch White Falcon and my Tele thinline! Thanks everyone for all the input. I have no affiliation w/ any of these vendors other than being a totally satisfied customer! BTW- Loves my fulldrive 2 pedal too!

Gregg
I couldn't agree more. The SMS CPA (Jerry style) is just the best sounding pre amp I've heard! I've had mine for about a month now (I think...you know how time is) and can't get over how sweet it sounds! Makes ya wanna play all the time! Thanks Brad! :smile: :smile: :smile:
 #102296  by Bear62
 Wed Aug 17, 2011 11:04 am
I just took my SMS on it's maiden gig last night. An open jam in a really LIVE (as in Echoe City) pool hall. Huge room. Took my Res Jerryblaster, OBEL and Waldo buffer. MV962 for power and SSP 2x12 w/ Weber Neomags. It ROARED! No pedal necessary to get that "on the edge" clean tone. Never thought a SS power amp could sound so good. Used my Fulldrive 2 for some grit and got those juicy feedback tones and so easy to just dial back on the volume and reign it back in. No mics on cabs. Just vocals. Ran the power amp at about 60% and SMS Gain at 2 o'clock. One of the most important things to note is this rig is DEAD quiet when you are not playing. w/ or w/ out a signal. No noise, no interference. So sweet. Thanks Brad and everyone here that helped along the way. I am not affiliated w/ any of these companies mentioned. Just a happy happy head playing music.

Regards, Gregg

PS. Played
I Shall Be Released
Like A Hurricane
For What It's Worth>Season of The Witch>FWIW
Wonderful Tonight
 #102297  by strumminsix
 Wed Aug 17, 2011 11:21 am
Bear62 wrote:I just took my SMS on it's maiden gig last night. An open jam in a really LIVE (as in Echoe City) pool hall. Huge room.
Glad it all worked out, Gregg! Where is this place at? Let me know next you are going, I'll try to join ya!
 #102300  by zambiland
 Wed Aug 17, 2011 4:17 pm
Rusty the Scoob wrote:
SarnoMusicSolutions wrote: I can add a very nice transformer balanced option to the SMS Classic for simultaneous XLR to PA output and also 1/4" output to your amp/speaker setup. Not sure, but I think it's about a $60 option. Bug me directly if interested.

Brad
You just sold me one of those! Sooner or later. The SMS custom bass edition. :cool:
+1! That with an effects loop would make the whole thing complete and be an Alembic F1X killer (unless you really need the crossover, but biamping is so 1995).

Hey, nice to meet in person, Dan! Next time we should do it with basses in hand.
 #102307  by Bear62
 Wed Aug 17, 2011 10:43 pm
Sure thing Nick. That would be fun! The cool thing about the SMS is all my guitars sound great out of it. Anyone else put a Les Paul thru your rig? My 73LP sounds sweeet!


G
 #102312  by Jon S.
 Thu Aug 18, 2011 6:07 am
Bear62 wrote:Received my SMS today. What a great sounding preamp. Running into a Tubeworks MV962 powering a SSP 2x12 w/ 16 ohm Weber Neomags in parallel at 8 ohms. Loud as I will ever need! Sounds great w/ my Gretsch White Falcon and my Tele thinline! Thanks everyone for all the input.
Glad you dig the speakers, Gregg. :smile: