Grateful Dead Music Forum

A place to talk about the music of the Grateful Dead 

 #18600  by BlobWeird
 Tue Jun 19, 2007 6:32 pm
For me its all about the Scarlet jam. If the jam isnt happenin I prolly wont even stick around for Fire

 #18617  by AugustWest
 Wed Jun 20, 2007 4:53 am
Scarlet jam is where it is at for me as well. I also like a nice transition between the two. 81-82 are the prime years for scarlet fire. I've notice that most drummers I meet absolutly love fire on the mountain. It's my drummers favorite song to play. He likes a lot of the clave' (sp?) songs too like NFA, Women smarter, Iko Iko, ect. but fire on the mountain is one of his favorites. I met another drummer at the local music store and we started talking about the dead and he too was all about fire on the mountain. Maybe it's one of those things that drummers love and guitarist and bassist kinda get bored with. Maybe the fact mickey hart had a large influence on the writting of the song.

Being a musician changes the music you hear. I don't know it's a thought.

 #18618  by Crazy 9.5 Fingers
 Wed Jun 20, 2007 5:12 am
I think the genius behind Fire is that it requires some serious skills to keep two chords interesting. For a lot of reggae, it is about the vocals, Bob, Spear, etc. these guys can keep it interesting with the vocals, mainly the stories, and their dynamics in the way they sing.

Jerry kind of touches that with Fire, if he can remember the words, but sometimes musically they just flat out nail the song, nail that rhythm and keep it driving for 10 minutes. Not an easy thing to do.

My last band I played in is a 14 piece Afrobeat band. All the stringed instruments in Afrobeat, the bass, rhythm and tenor guitars, all play their respective lines over and over again, basically a human loop machine. The challenge is to keep that beat nailed and locked. In the end, a huge rhythmic wall is formed that can not be knocked down. Listen to some Fela Kuti and yu will hear what I am talking about. Some of those Fires that still blow me away are ones where that beat never misses. Maybe for some the musicality of two chords back and forth gets monotonous, but for me, and for the drummers August West alludes to, it is all about the power of keeping that beat.

 #18619  by bodiddley
 Wed Jun 20, 2007 7:11 am
I judge them on overall cohesiveness. The transition being as important as everything else. I prefer a shorter "Fire" than a longer one. A great stand alone "Scarlet" is the one on the "Day on the Green" Dicks release. Excellent work by Bob on that as well as his work on the "Sugaree".

5-4-77...excellent Scar/Fire.

 #18625  by LazyLightnin
 Wed Jun 20, 2007 7:40 am
5/4/77 was the first true Scarlet>Fire...i think, anyone confirm?

 #18631  by zoppenheimer
 Wed Jun 20, 2007 8:32 am
Not Fade Away also only has two chords, but as Crazy 9.5 Fingers said, it's how you keep those two chords going. It's that drum beat that makes it extra funky also, that makes the song for me

 #18636  by bodiddley
 Wed Jun 20, 2007 9:19 am
5/4/77 was the first true Scarlet>Fire...i think, anyone confirm?

No, I believe it was during the 3-18 thru 3-20 run in 77.

They got the drums locked in on that version with Santana.

 #18640  by LazyLightnin
 Wed Jun 20, 2007 10:50 am
aiye ayie 8)

 #18648  by grateful4booze
 Wed Jun 20, 2007 1:28 pm
Winterland 10/22/78 is one of my favorites. The first was Winterland 3/18/77.

 #18679  by TheDude
 Thu Jun 21, 2007 1:45 am
The closing of Winterland is one of my all time favorites.. those two songs actually got me hooked on the Grateful Dead..

 #19042  by toastandjam
 Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:35 am
35FLA wrote: 3-22-90 Copps Coliseum, Hamilton, Ontario, Canada....
I'm glad you mentioned this one...but it moves me so much I'm going to highlight it again.
It's hosted on archive (I may have even linked it as my first post in that other thread way back, I've had this discussion before) as well as's free stash.

And since the discussion of May 77 is open, how about 05/25/77 instead? That's a fine S>F. Also, the Peggy-O is achingly beautiful, oh! and check out the Brown Eyed Women! Probably the best ever, that I've heard anyway. The solo is hot, hot, hot...

 #19044  by tigerstrat
 Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:51 am
strumminsix wrote:Nice TS!!! Easy... Scarlet (after the first verse I skip Fire)

You are REALLY missing out there. PLEASE go to 2/27/81 Fire and start listening at 8:00, and go for about 30 seconds.

 #19051  by bodiddley
 Wed Jun 27, 2007 9:40 am
3-22-90 Copps Coliseum, Hamilton, Ontario, Canada....

That's the one on the "SMR" box set. At first I didn't care for it but now I love it. The midi work right before they drop into "Fire" is exceptional with really great band interaction going on.

 #19068  by krzykat
 Wed Jun 27, 2007 11:17 am
How about the scarlet> touch> fire from the greek 7/13/84! rockin[/code]

 #19156  by Hajimemashite!!!
 Thu Jun 28, 2007 8:14 am
Surprisingly my favorite scarlet > fire is from seattle 5/26/95