\ Scales for Grateful Dead Repository
Scales for Grateful Dead repository
jhc



Ebick wrote:

Quote:
We need more of this.

It's great to have different scales posted, and Kenny goes deep on that subject. But I think it would be great if players would post how they apply different scales to each song.

I'd even like to add a line to each page in the archve to say.....

For solos, try..........

Anyone want to tackle that task?


Why dont we use this to compile the scales we all use for various solos, and Ed can add the information to the song files as needed.

I'm not much of a lead guitar player, but I'll kick it off with a couple of ideas

Playin' - 70's version D Dorian (D minor)
later versions D mixolydian

Scarlet - dont use a single scale, play the chord changes

Fire - B mixolydian

Dark Star - A mixolydian for the main theme

Truckin' = E blues

Not Fade Away - either E blues or E major pentatonic +/- bluesy grace notes

Iko Iko - alternate D major (pentatonic) with A major (pentatonic) with the chord changes
Kenny




Samantha Fox Lita Ford mud wrestlemania

If putting down simplistic scalar ideas for Dead
numbers would be helpful...........I'll abide.

Don't forget your playing over chords and chords
are scales blocked up or frozen or sold from banana
carts covered with chocolate and rotten mayonaise.

If you've heard alot of Dead renditions of numbers
you've undoubtedly heard wrong notes,flubs or
meandering.

Deal is a classic example. Some fantastic! some others meandering and wrong notes.

I was doing a show yesterday that ended with
Paranoid by Black Sabbath.

Someone came up to me afterwards and said I love the
Paranoid I can really hear alot of different things
Tony Iommi has done live in the number but what about
the original?

I thought to myself I don't even know how the original goes anymore I have spent so much time studying his live tendencies.

What about Ten years Gone by Zeppelin (I played that
to) Well my versions are directly inspired by
and frankly lifted directly sometimes from Zep 77
renditions.

So here's how I do Deal scalewise

Deal- A Mixolydian with a flat 3rd and a natural 7th
added for the chromatic high string descending line.
If ya heard it you'd get it exactly. The solo
starts in pattern 1 and then moves up one octave to
the same pattern. One could look at it as A Ionian with a flat 7th and flat 3rd. It wouldn't be
technically correct but if it helps the head to think that way go ahead.

Rosemary- E Ionian with a flat 7th. added. You can
stick around pattern 1 throughout.

Franklin's Tower - A Mixolydian in patterns 5 and
1 in the next octave primarily.

Me and my Uncle - G major pentatonic with a
flat 3rd and flat 5th added. flat 3rd A# flat 5th D#

(which is flat 6th of Ionian D# as explained below)

Heaven Help the Fool - A lydian.
"That's not a Dead one!!"

Well gotta go. The Gooch is waiting to beat me up
after school.

If ya want more or more in depth I will accomodate
regulate or was it formulate?

Kenny





"Envy me. This is my wife. Those are my kids and I sell women's shoes."

Now of course you can add outside notes to lead up to
a note etc.

For the song Me and My Uncle.

I put down for the solo G maj pent- G A B D E with
a flat 3rd A# and a flat 5th D#.

This is clarified by putting down the specific notes
because it is a rather sticky situation.

Technically D# is the flat 6th of Ionian but the
flat 5th of G pent major to some folks.

This was discussed previously and technically it
should be referred to as the flat 6th but many many
folks refer to it as the flat 5th of the G pent major.


Let's look at this same idea being referred to
Brown Eyed Women.

Brown eyed Women- E Ionian with an omitted 4th and
an added flat 3rd and flat 6th.

The omitted note is A. Which is the 4th of E.
So avoid the A note.

E Ionian E F# G# A B C# D#

Above we see E Ionian

E pent major E F# G# B C#

Above we see E pent major

So the flat 3rd is G and the flat 6th of Ionian is C.

C would be the flat 5th of E pent.

I know this is wrong B is ALWAYS the 5th of E but
some folks mostly old timers look at it as scale degrees or notes in general. They see 5 notes and
name it as such.

So let's look at the notes used.

E Ionian with an omitted 4th E F# G# B C# D#

flat 3rd G Flat 6th C

If this confuses remember always the Ionian or major
scale is the correct scale degree option.

Growing up in Chicago and going to many country places as well I ran into this many times by older
folks who probably live and die on pentatonics and
everything else means nothing to them.

So maybe I should explain some other lingo used
above.

Deal- I put down A Mixolydian with a flat 3rd and
a natural 7th etc.

A Mixolydian has a flat 7th so the natural 7th is
A Ionian's 7th degree which is G#.

Some of the discussions previously on scale note
additions will help you understand if you are confused and in the end every scale is compared to
Ionian even the minor modes.

For future use I will defer to the correct Ionian
scale degree definitions.

"Peg will you get that? It's probably the "Homeless
it could be worse." tour."
jck_strw






Excellent idea and excellent information.

Like Oliver, "More please!"
_________________
http://db.etree.org/jck_strw
----
"Weir on a mission from Bob"
Kenny





Even Hulk don't wanna date She-hulk. He'd rather
date Broom Hilda until Wonder Woman is available.

Cream Puff War- solo 1 G Ionian with and added
flat 3rd and flat 7th

solo 2 - A min pentatonic with the natural 3rd added.


Eyes of the world - intro E Ionian,

solo 1 E Ionian with an added flat 7th and flat 3rd

solo 2 E Ionian with an added flat 3rd, flat 5th
and flat 7th.


Why does Richie Rich buy and wear the same outfit
over and over. Cadbury was the real star!


What's with Archie? Betty was way hotter and Veronica
was a huge B. Moose shoulda beat down Reggie and
killed Mr.Weatherbee.


Mr.G's favorite pick to use - Adamas graphite tear
drop. 2.0 mm thick
jhc





Kenny, on Deal, are you using the same scale for solo #1, which is based on the verse chord and solo #2 which is based on the chorus?

Thanks man - you always have some great info.
Kenny




Lenny and Squiggy television's first stalkers


Sure you can use the same scalar ideas. There is a bit more leading tones in solo two and feel free to
add more outside notes if you'd like. This song inclines one to come up with instant melodies in a
swift pace. Simplistic ideas that envelope alot of
notes many times work so don't over think it. The flat 3rd is an excellent "pivot" note.

"I knew my parents hated me. My bath toys were a
radio and a toaster."

The fill in notes in the chorus and verse can be
quite simple and over doing these portions never
comes across well.


Mrs Garrett television's ugliest madame
Billbbill





With the verse solo I find that working from the "other end" can open up some cool ideas. That is add in some licks based on flat (and/or finger) picking some chords at different transitions and move around on the neck. Just picking out the chords and bridging a line for the full verse can be instructive. The one draw back I find is there's less room for error. Not exactly the pentatonic "no wrong note" approach.


"My wife's cooking is bad, - it's so bad the flies pitched in to fix the screen door"

Couldn't resist Kenny!
Kenny






That's a good one! Sounds like ya got bad luck like
me I asked my father in law for a cold one and he
introduced me to his daughter...

Just jokin I'm not married but I wish I was for the
jokes alone.

Interesting I gather you play acoustic? Finger picking and flat picking and banjo rolls are fun.

Arpeggios are wonderful and Mr. G had a different
approach to them then Django or Yngwie who at
times overstate the chord. Which I enjoy very much
it just is very different degrees of emphasizing
the notes.

Adding finger picked lines to songs on electric is
something Tony Iommi does. I put alot of time into
it and it can be fun but you will have to make slight
adjustments to volume and in some cases other tonal
effects.


Thanks Billbill! Have fun!


My wife says she wants to do it in exotic places
She's been gone for 2 weeks.


I wouldn't say my wife's cooking is bad but the dogs
beg the neighbors through the windows for food and
it's embarassing cuz they learned how to beg watching
our honeymoon video.


that's all I got off the top of my pointed head.
Kenny




"I'd rather be a lightning rod than a seismograph"
Ken Kesey

Comes a time is a "decievingly" simple song as
Jimmy Herring once put.

The song is in A major throughout and it's important
to not over do it.

It was Mr.G's vocal delivery that made the entire
song besides the simple melodic solo.

The solo is A maj pent A B C# E F# with an added
4th D or you can look at it as A Ionian with an
omitted 7th.

It really is just a slow melodic solo for the ballad.

The entire solo is primarily in one pattern.

Here's a look at a skeletal solo intro

e---------------------------------------------------
b--------15-17-17b18-17b19--------------------------
g-14h16----------------------16b18--16p14-------14v-
d-------------------------------------------16------
a---------------------------------------------------
e---------------------------------------------------

The bend on the G string from 16 to 18 can be
replace by a half step bend of 16 to 17 to the
flat 3rd for a more sadder blues sound.

The above should give you good ideas to start and
then simply continue melodically and don't overdo it.


Mr. G always had simple understated fun endings to
solos and learning ways to "wrap things up" with
endings is essential.

Below is a look at a solo ending idea for
Comes a Time.

e---------------------------------------------------
b------------17-------------------------------------
g-16b17hold-------16p14-----------------------------
d------------------------16-14----------------------
a-------------------------------16s14-12------------
e------------------------------------------14-12h14-


e----------------------------------------------------
b----------------------------------------------------
g----------------------------------------------------
d------------7---------------------------------------
a--------0-------------------------------------------
e-12-14----------------------------------------------


**********Went*Walking*All*Morning*******************


It's like a kick in the head
to meet old Tennesee Jed
Althea and Dupree
I knew I was dreaming
when the blind man said
"don't you see".........................
Kenny





Asteroid 4442 approximately 160 kilometers across
discovered by Tom Gehrels on 9/14/85 was named in
November of 1995. The International Astromical
Union approved the name Jerry Garcia.............

Big Railroad Blues is in A major.

The solo is in A major pentatonic A B C# E F#
with a flat 7th G and a flat 3rd C


e---------------------------------------15---12-
b-----------------17-17-17----------------------
g-14-16b18hold--------------18r16-14------------
d---------------hold bend-----------------------
a-----------------------------------------------
e-----------------------------------------------


e-------------------------------------------------
b-------------------------------------------------
g--16b18r16--14-----------------------------------
d-------------------------------------------------
a-------------------------------------------------
e-------------------------------------------------


Above is a look at a skeletal intro

The chord tones of A major are spelled out in the
beginning (A C# E)

Most of the solo is in the same pattern.

Spacecaseracemacepacefacebasevase

The boxroxtoxvox box pattern

.
waldo041





thank you kenny, your wisdom is much appreciated. i am new to the forum, but have been using rukind tabs for many years. i have moved on from the pentatonic scales to the modes and i tell you what. the 5 pattern lessons really helped to connect the dots. also some of the other lessons helped to ensure that i was on the right track. i would hope that you post more of the modes used in the GD tunes as these really do help decipher the tunes. thanks again and hopefully you'll keep them coming. peace, waldo
Kenny





Well that's awful kind of you waldo. The insane
ramblings I put on the site are never completed
or taken to thier proper length.

Your probably the only one that reads them so for
you to take the time to say somethin' kind says
alot.

I'm ecstatic you have found some use in the jumbled
mess and I know it is with your own determination
that you have gotten something out of it and your
probably a remarkable player.

The modes are a wonderful journey in understandings.

They turn the fretboard from a perilous frightening
world to a much smaller friendlier and familiar
place.


Continue on the journey and after many years you'll
be led back home!!!

but you'll be a much better, fluent player with
those "understandings" pushing you past the limits
of where you ever hoped to be..........


Of course I'll keep postin' if you'd like

just keep readin' and I will help you.


Next Time you see me

A pretty simple ancient tune in A major.

The Dead did an upbeat version of the authorless
tune.

The upbeat version is more popular and performed
by many.


The solo is A Mixolydian A B C# D E F# G
with a flat 3rd C, a flat 6th F and a natural 7th G#

Natural 7th simply means the 7th of A Ionian.

Every scale is compared to the major scale so lies
the idea natural 7th.

Notice the flat 6th. A popular choice when using
pentatonic or modes with a "pentatonic flair"


The flat 3rd is playing with the major/minor
tonality.

Mr.G in most cases stays in one pattern.


"Y'all come back now ya hear."
waldo041




hey hey hey,

thanks again for a wonderful breakdown of a grate GD tune.

Kenny i understand that the natural 7th is just the 7th taken from the A ionian. so am i safe to assume that the flat 3rd and flat 6th are also taken from the A ionian? also are they added to the notes in the A Mixolydian or am i to omit the mixolydian 3rd and 6th and insert the flat 3rd and flat 6th? as well as the natural 7th? thanks again for your generosity. peace, waldo
Kenny




No definetly no omitting, I'd tell ya if ya needed to

Only when using the word natural would I be referring
to the Ionian scale.

The flat 3rd is just that....

The flat 3rd of A Mixolydian is C.

The flat 3rd addition is a means of playing with
the major and minor tonality.

This is a very common age old practice.

The flat 3rd denotes a minor tonality and is the
strongest denotation of a minor tonality.

The flat 7th and the flat 6th also denote
the minor tonality.

A Mixolydian has the flat 7th G



A Aeolian A B C D E F G

A Mixolydian A B C# D E F# G

Above is the A Aeolian and A Mixolydian scales.

A quick glance shows the only difference is the
3rd (A Aeolian has a flattened 3rd C) and the 6th
(A Aeolian has a flattened 6th F)


It may blow your mind a little at first to realize
that the flat 7th is a minor tonality.


The mixing of minor tonalities in a major setting
is an age old move.


A Ionian A B C# D E F# G#

A Aeolian A B C D E F G


Above we see the A Ionian and A Aeolian scales.

A quick glance reveals that to make A Ionian into
and A Aeolian scale.

You simply inject the minor tonalities of a flat 3rd
flat 6th and a flat 7th.


Now when I simply put the scale and scale additions
of a G D song down.

I am implying it is this scale (whichever scale mentioned) and these are the note additions.

It is not to be read as these are all the notes and
make up a synthetic scale using all the notes.


It is simply saying this is the scale and these are
the additions that are included at points.

Again I'll definetly let you know it there are omissions.


Your getting better and better waldo.


I'm happy to help


Have a beautiful day...........


"should I start playing here"

"you better or I'll start shooting."
waldo041





Kenny wrote:
I am implying it is this scale (whichever scale mentioned) and these are the note additions.

It is not to be read as these are all the notes and
make up a synthetic scale using all the notes.


It is simply saying this is the scale and these are
the additions that are included at points.



Right on! after my post i realized that this was another option based on the solo for next time you see me

Kenny wrote:

The solo is A Mixolydian A B C# D E F# G
with a flat 3rd C, a flat 6th F and a natural 7th G#

Natural 7th simply means the 7th of A Ionian.


I realized here that C is the flat of the 3rd C# and the same thing for the 6th.F being the flat of F#. also, thanks for clearing up that "at points" these are used.

you are a 110% right that those darn scale books, and the like, are out to confuse. they have confused me for so many years. i had learned all seven modes from there root to root, two octave scales, but it took me til your post on the 5 patterns to finally connect them all. look at me now, i am adding 3rd's and 6th's and natural 7's for that matter.not only that but i now know that i can do this for all the modes. you are one true jedi master.
thanks again, peace, waldo
Kenny





Jedi Master! I thought I was Bobafett!

Well your moving fast on the instrument.

and that's what it's all about.


I've always said guitar is something one should
never get discouraged at

because you can pass up those that are more advanced
then you.


Players hit certain levels and are content or
under motivated and do not progress.

and you can pass em on by.........


The modes are simply 5 patterns.....


5 shapes that never change


they simply move to suit different key changes.


They are connected and move in a chain up or down.


Like a ferris wheel that moves in both directions.


You can spend a lifetime discovering new understandings of the patterns.


In all honesty another scale does not have to be
learned again.


The mode patterns can simply be altered to fit
any scale.


Even the most foreign or combined (hybrid) scale.


Your flying down the highway with bright blue skies.


You'll pass me by


I'll be standing there with a thumb up on the way
to the promised land.




"getupgetingetout"
Kenny




*c*a*t*s*u*p><><k*e*t*c*h*u*p

riseuptotheshining


Playin in the band.+.:>/.........!!


sOlO

D Dorian D E F G A B C

with a flat 2nd D#

and a sharp 4th G#


downaspiralstairway


Yep that't the flat 2nd D# from D phyrgian.


afterforeverwhendeathcallsbacktoeden


Touch of Grey


sOlO

B Ionian B C# D# E F# G# A#

with a flat 6th G and a flat 7th A


sromurylgu
uglyroomers
Kenny





Alvin, Simon, ........Theodore!!!!!!


"wax on, wax off"

*******neon****lights***on***broadway****************

Scarlet Begonias

B Mixolydian B C# D# E F# G# A
with a flat 6th G and a natural 7th A#


rings on her fingers, bells on her shoes


Golden Road

sOlO:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

D pentatonic major D E F# A B
with a flat 6th A#


we will be selling knives...............

"I sell propane and propane accessories"
waldo041






Kenny, once again thanks for the knowledge. i was practicin' my mixolydian mode pattern in the 10th position. i believe D Mixolydian, and when i started counting 5(d), 6(e), 7(f#), 1(g) etc. i soon figured out again part of the 5 patterns lesson. i figured out that, if i play a mixolydian pattern that when i get to 1 it is in fact the start of the Ionian mode in this case g ionian. this big feat helped me to realize that it is not as hard as i thought. i can now quickly figure out how to change the mode.i thought i'd pass this on to you and let you know that someone is reading and learning from your lessons. thank you, thank you, thank you. now back to practicin those 5 patterns. peace, waldo
Kenny






Great job waldo!! Your making those crucial realizations or understandings. These breakthroughs
connect to other ideas you've already learned and
make everything a bit easier.

Everything connects

I'm ecstatic that you are making great strides and
I humbly thank you for posting that info.

Go waldo Go,

Any questions or help you feel I can give you.

Feel free to ask..........


Your doing fantastic!!!


Keep pursuing the numbers aspect

You may already be familiar with chord construction
and those same numbers can be applied.

Heck everything can be put into numbers and everything can be put into a scale.

Even chords are just scale notes stacked together.


If you see how those modes are together in a chain
always connected....


You'll find Mixolydian is always followed by Aeolian
then Locrian etc.


I recommend working with paper and pen and writing
out and quizzing yourself.


You will see things clearer and it is a way to
practice without the guitar in you hands.


I will be happy to share all the info I have studied
over the years and my realizations and answer any
questions you can think of.......


I'm excited for you and I know you are excited yourself as the instrument becomes a bit easier to
play and you put some distance between you and others
on the instrument.

"y'all come back now, ya here."
Kenny






I'll discuss some more about the patterns and hopefully through some of the thoughts some more
things will click for you.

Thier is a host of other scales that are similar
to the modes with the exception of a note or two
as well as exotic scales that with some adjustments to the modes can be accomplished easily.

I would be happy to post the ideas for that later on
which would complete a great deal of your journey
and give you the keys to accomplish many fantastic
sounds.


You have been studying the patterns and it may be
best for you to put the patterns in non tab form
on a sheet of paper vertically.


Separate each pattern in C Ionian and write out
each note as it's modal name.

This will allow you to see the pattern shape as
well as seeing the root notes for each mode.

Learning this is essential because these ideas never
change.


For example if were in pattern #1 in C Ionian
on the low E string the first note would be Mixolydian.

That will never change.

On can alter that note but it will always be Mixolydian.

It's also an important key to realize that each
mode follows the other always.

If ya know where the Ionian note is then the next
note is Dorian and if ya know where the Dorian note
is the next note is Phyrgian and so on.

Focus on Ionian first.

Making sure that you are very familiar with that mode
first.

Some players skip ahead to quick and it's important
to know them all but if ya skip ahead to quick
everything becomes a bit jumbled.

I can't emphasize enough to quiz yourself.

To quiz what notes are in G Mixolydian or A Dorian.

The work you do on pen and paper is priceless down
the road.

The best players have always worked out things on
paper endlessly.

You won't regret it.

It is essential.

When you know what notes are in a specific scale the
next player who hasn't done his homework is only
guessing and hoping.

There is 2 sides to it.

The knowledge of all the ideas and understandings.

and the ability to implement and perform those
ideas.


If you continue which I'm sure you will, you are
a bright person.

You'll surprise yourself as the ideas become hardwired into brain.

Be patient and always keep chipping away.

Others who practice or play guitar merely hope to
tread water.

They want to be able to keep remembering ideas and
patterns and not fall behind.

but with your understandings so far you realize it
is just these 5 patterns and you have a lifetime
to learn em inside and out.

Your moving at a swift pace but you should always
remember to be patient.

With all the complexity written about the modes they
really are simple.

They are just very slight adjustments to the major
scale.

If you look at it from a major (Ionian) and minor
(Aeolian) perspective.

There really is far less adjustments.


The beauty of the 5 patterns presented is that it
eliminates learning countless lines and different
patterns from different teachers or books.


You simply need to know 5 simple patterns.

Nevermind step patterns, whole step half step etc

in the mean time you are learning the fretboard and
everything becomes smaller and easier and less
daunting.

Your learning scale construction, how the modes
compare with the pentatonic scales and much more.


I'll be brutally honest when I say.........


You'll never find a publication or in many cases a
teacher who truly wants you to grasp and absorb
ideas and understandings quickly.


You'll never find a player who is willing to reveal
what took him years to figure out or the true secrets
to his technique.

The player will either play dumb and act as if he
knows nothing or he will go the opposite way and
act as if he knows everything and fill you with
useless jargon.

Your road to where you want to be on the instrument
lies in one person, one teacher, one guru and one
prophet.


That is yourself.........


Always see yourself as your own teacher.

Tackle and destroy obstacles that hold you back.


If playing a certain combination or even just one
chord from the other is difficult.

tackle it and beat it

Guitar is a beautiful awe inspiring instrument.

A lifelong journey

There is always something to practice

always something new to learn

Never let a non guitar playing musician say his
instrument is better.

He could never accomplish any of the multitude of
fantastic things a guitarist can.

A saxophonists can become faster much quicker but
his or her road is much shorter and thier is far
less they can do.

Piano is fun but it is a simple lackluster substitute
for the incredible dimensions reached on guitar.

I KNOW you can become better than me or others.

That is the beauty of the guitar you can travel fast
and move fast and some places take a long way to
get to......

So if your moving slow you'll never get there.

I have helped many on guitar in my life and many
have stolen my ideas and I don't mind.

I want others to be great.

I have absorbed and learned from many and whenever
someone discussed guitar whether I liked thier style
I listened.

I always tried to learn from every player, every re
cording, every word.

Music notes are everywhere from the musical notes
of the city streets to the beauty of the country.

When I was little I would sit in the woods and listen to the birds and the notes they created and
try to put them together.

and when I really listened I could hear thier language.

When they were singing, when they were mad, when
they were amourous.

Thier notes were not random as so few notes are.

It is essential to always strive for absolute pitch.

Many will say it's impossible but every professional musician as some semblance of it.

They know when they are hitting the wrong note.

They know what key they are in.

You must always strive to have perfect absolute pitch
and if you fail you will be very good anyway.


Each note has a specific sound.

When a song is in the Key of A major every note
is connected and working with that note.

They are all bouncing off and playing with that note.

Take some time and review the keys of your favorite
musical numbers.

Whether thier is key changes or outside notes thrown
in, etc.

It is the detective work you do on many songs especially the ones that have influenced you that will greatly help you.

You'll find out what you like to hear or liked to hear and why.

In the end you'll find yourself playing a certain way.

You can never hide from your true self and your personality will always come out.

Every player plays differently if they have any talent.

Even the hardest death metal player might pick up the
guitar at home and play country or jazz.

He gets paid to play a certain way and he's trapped in a box but when he is alone with the instrument
he gets to be himself and play what comes natural.

We can try to be a certain way on the instrument but
in the end you will be yourself.


Embrace it. Even if it's crazy or hokey or soft.


Explore all music and explore the real music inside
yourself.
waldo041






"i brought my pencil, give me something to write on!"

thanks again kenny, i have been quizzing myself and have developed a few charts ( answerkeys) that help me to find the different patterns for each mode without a guitar in my hands.

ionian
1-whole step
2-whole step
3-half step
4-whole step
5-whole step
6-whole step
7-halfstep

dorian
2-whole step
3-half step
4-whole step
5-whole step
6-whole step
7-halfstep
1-whole step

phrygian
3-half step
4-whole step
5-whole step
6-whole step
7-halfstep
1-whole step
2-whole step

lydian
4-whole step
5-whole step
6-whole step
7-halfstep
1-whole step
2-whole step
3-half step

mixolydian
5-whole step
6-whole step
7-halfstep
1-whole step
2-whole step
3-half step
4-whole step

aeolian
6-whole step
7-halfstep
1-whole step
2-whole step
3-half step
4-whole step
5-whole step

locrian
7-halfstep
1-whole step
2-whole step
3-half step
4-whole step
5-whole step
6-whole step

like i said this only helps to find the patterns on paper for now. i know that you said to put aside the whole step, half step thing, but i thought you might like to see what i accomplished.

i also made myself an answer key for all the modes and there notes. it is something that i can turn to as quick reference if and when i get stuck.

http://www.geocities.com/waldo041/modechart.htm

so for now i will be quizing myself a lot and keep on working on the patterns. believe me i have more questions about the guitar but want to fully grasp what is on my plate now before i go for up seconds. thanks again. peace, waldo
Kenny






"Lazy days and crazy nights!"

Hey now, WOW! Love that "Hot for Teacher" reference.

The only reason I say stay away from the whole step
half step at this point is because I would like you to see the pattern on a sheet of paper.

visualazation is the key.

I wish I could type it out but I just can't

It's a vertical look at the patterns and thier shape.


There is much to be gained from it.



C Ionian C-w-D-w-E-h-F-w-G-w-A-w-B-h

D Dorian D-w-E-h-F-w-G-w-A-w-B-h-C-W

The above may be an easier way to look at whole step
half step


"one step two step close the door, all my records
are on the floor."


Your doing EXCELLENT!
Kenny






"Hey your sorta like a celebrity, like the fat
kid from Head of the Class."

Here's a quiz for you waldo

1. The Ionian scale can be turned into the Lydian
scale by the sharpening of what note?

2. What 2 scale degrees are missing from an Ionian
scale to a pentatonic major scale?

3. The Aeolian scale can be turned into the Dorian
scale by the sharpening of what note?

4. D Ionian has the same notes as the <blank>
Lydian scale.

5. The Phyrgian and the Dorian scale differ by
what notes?

6. What is the 5th scale degree of A Ionian?

7. Match the below scales on the right with the
scale on the left that contains the same notes

F Ionian---------------------------------E Ionian

E Lydian---------------------------------C Dorian

B Mixolydian-----------------------------A# Lydian

G Aeolian--------------------------------F# Mixolydia


extra credit: rent the 1986 movie "Crossroads" and
the movie "Petulia" and practice the patterns with
alternate picking while watching........




The Bozo grand prize game!!
waldo041





OK! I'm game!

Kenny wrote:
1. The Ionian scale can be turned into the Lydian
scale by the sharpening of what note?

1-sharpen the 4th of ionian


Kenny wrote:
2. What 2 scale degrees are missing from an Ionian
scale to a pentatonic major scale?

2- the 4th degree and the 6th degree are dropped from the ionian

Kenny wrote:
3. The Aeolian scale can be turned into the Dorian
scale by the sharpening of what note?

3- A aeolian A B C D E F G
A dorian A B C D E F#/Gb G
so to get a dorian mode from an aeolian mode you sharpen the 6th of aeolian

Kenny wrote:
4. D Ionian has the same notes as the <blank>
Lydian scale.

4- G lydian

Kenny wrote:
5. The Phyrgian and the Dorian scale differ by
what notes?

5- e phyrgian E F G A B C D
e dorian E F# G# A B C# D#
dorian has a sharp 2nd, 3rd, 6th, and 7th from the phrygian

Kenny wrote:
6. What is the 5th scale degree of A Ionian?

6-E mixolydian

Kenny wrote:
7. Match the below scales on the right with the
scale on the left that contains the same notes

F Ionian---------------------------------E Ionian

E Lydian---------------------------------C Dorian

B Mixolydian-----------------------------A# Lydian

G Aeolian--------------------------------F# Mixolydia

7-E ionian & B mixolydian
C dorian & G aeolian
A# lydian & F ionian
F# mixolydian & E lydian

Kenny wrote:
extra credit: rent the 1986 movie "Crossroads" and
the movie "Petulia" and practice the patterns with
alternate picking while watching........

plan on working on this in the future.

thanks for the quiz it was fun and educating. i will make sure to quiz myself in the same manner. i am anxious to see if i am on the right track and hope to better memorize these, so that i may one day roll these out off the top of my head. keep'em coming! peace be with you my friend, waldo
Kenny






Yo Rerun! Hey, Hey, Hey,

Excellent job Spicoli! Mr. Hand is very pleased.


Great job!

Just a couple of tiny discrepencies.

On question #2 the difference between an Ionian and
a pent Major scale.

You definetly would not omit the 6th because that
is the relative minor.

Let's take a look:

C pent Major - C D E G A

C Ionian - C D E F G A B

The 6th of C Ionian is A which is the relative minor
of C.

The difference would be the 4th and the 7th.

Which connects again to your modal study.

The #4th is the difference between Lydian and Ionian

and the flat 7th is the difference between Mixolydian
and Ionian.


It works the same for Aeolian.

A pent minor - A C D E G

A Aeolian - A B C D E F G

The difference here would be the 2nd and the 6th.

The difference between Aeolian and Phyrgian is the
flat 2nd.

and the difference between Aeolian and Dorian is
the #6th.


So it is the notes that differ that are indeed missing.


This allows pentatonic players to add notes of color
as well.


on question 5

This is another understanding for you.

E phyrgian - E F G A B C D

E Dorian - E F# G A B C# D

Now the 3rd G# is always flattened in the three modal
minor scales.

The 3rd represents a crucial minor tonality.

Like in the E Major chord
and the E minor chord

E Major chord - E G# A

E minor chord - E G A

Well we know that the E Aeolian scale is

E F# G A B C D

and the E phyrgian scale flattens the 2nd.

E phyrgian E F G A B C D

We know that the E Dorian scale sharpens the 6th.

E F# G A B C# D

So by deduction the difference between E Phyrgian
and E Dorian

(or any Phyrgian and Dorian scale)

is 2 notes

E phyrgian E F G A B C D

E Dorian E F# G A B C# D

Those 2 notes are the 2nd which Phyrgian flattens and
the 6th which Dorian sharpens

(2nd and 6th)

See those connections again?

This works the same for the Major scales.

Let's take a look:

C Ionian C D E F G A B

C Lydian C D E F# G A B

C Mixolydian C D E F G A A#

The difference between the C lydian and C Mixolydian
scales

(or any Lydian and Mixolydian scales)

is the 4th and the 7th.

You see cuz Lydian sharpens the 4th and Mixolydian
flattens the 7th.

connection-noitcennoc

The quiz was to let you gain some more understandings.

You do not have to quiz yourself in the same manner


Looking for gaps in your learning and attacking those
would be better suited.


In any event your going to summer school.

but hey we'll all be there having fun and picking
and grinning.............


Epstein.......here

Horshack............here

Beuller........Beuller........Beuller........Beuller

Beuller........Beuller.......
waldo041






ok i understand my mistakes and appreciate the knowledge.

on question 2. i had known it was the 7th degree, but for some reason wrote the 6th. careless error. i need to slow down a bit sometimes.

as for question 5. i did the same thing. if you look at my chart that i made, it has the correct notes for the e dorian scale. i obviously was in a rush and after the 2nd degree (F#) i began writing down the 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th and 7th of f dorian. again going to fast. little mistakes that i need to slow down and double check. thanks so much for the quiz. i really am starting to learn the modes a lot better and need to slow down so i don't get lost. thanks again for your teachings. keep'em coming. peace waldo

"spicoli: was that the bell?"
Kenny






Hey that's alright. You got an A++. Stick around
for the panty raids and ROAD TRIP!

"I'm gonna get those nerds!"

lambda,lambda,lambda
waldo041






"We'll Leave A Light On"

It took a couple of readings, but the explanations for my two answers i believe may have finally suck in.

from what i have read i summarize that the differences between the aeolian and the other 2 minor modes (phrygian,dorian). the difference is the 2nd and the 6th. i know understand that if i play an aeolian pattern , if i want to change to another minor mode, all i need to do is either flatten the 2nd of the aeolian to get phyrgian or sharpen the 6th of aeolian to get a dorian mode.

as you stated, the same can be used for the major modes.

if i take the ionian pattern i can sharpen the 4th to make a lydian pattern and flatten the 7th to change to a mixolydian pattern. pretty easy now

i was working on the patterns on the guitar and the changing of them and it makes a whole bunch more sense now.

i do have a couple of Q's.

1) if all that is changed in the aeolian pattern is the 2 minor tones the 2nd, and 6th

and the 4th and the 7th from the ionian are the tones that change.

if i look at the tones from the ionian mode;

1 major
2 minor
3 minor
4 major
5 major
6 minor
7 diminished

am i to think that the 7th is a major tone? or am i missing something?

2)also, the locrian mode is a diminished mode (and i will quiz myself to find the answer), but is it a combination of both the minor and major tones that change?
which scale does it adapt from? aeolian or ionian?

thanks again kenny. hope to hear from you soon. peace, waldo
Kenny






"Norton! get down here!"


Your flying now K.I.T., um I mean Starsky wait I mean
Hardcastle.

On to the first question........

1. which is if the 7th is a major tone?

Certain tones denote a minor tonality and certain tones denote a major tonality.

For the record a flat 7th which Mixolydian employs
is a minor tonality.

That's why it is so cool and easily workable to
play minor pentatonic scales over a dominant 7th chord.

For example A min pent or A Phyrgian over an A7 chord.

The notes that denote a minor tonality are the ones
to watch out for.

Some will sound like %%#%% ove a major chord such
as a flattened 3rd over a major chord. yuck!

Is a natural 7th in the range of a major tonality.

yes..

but it's nothing to freak out over or to over think.

cuz a flattened 7th in many cases can be added
or substituted.


Larry Appleton Chicago's biggest ladies man....or
is it Balki?


let's look at # 2

2. Is Locrian derived from major or minor?

Well all the modes are derived from the major scale
(Ionian)

Locrian is the odd ball of the group because of it's
odd step pattern.

I have always told folks focus on the other 6 modes
and by default you will know Locrian.

Locrian is just not as applicable by far as the other
modes.

Players like Steve Vai have gone out of thier way to
implement Locrian.

and of course it has it's uses.


Let's take a look at Locrian.

B Locrian

B C D E F G A

as you can see it has a

flat 2nd, flat 3rd, flat 5th, flat 6th and flat 7th.

I would love to go into full detail about this scale
but it is really best you focus on the other 6 modes.

and not get ahead.

Leave Locrian for last.

for the record Locrian is known by most as the diminished mode, ah.... but it is alot more than that.



"Thomas! Thomas! you get that mouse before I come
back from the store."
Kenny






"What would you do for a Klondike bar?"


Help on the way is based in F Dorian.

The solo is in F Dorian F G G# A# C D D#
with a # 3rd (or natural 3rd) A and a sharp 7th E.
(or natural 7th)


Freddy Kruger
"I'm your boyfriend now Nancy."


The additions of the natural 3rd A and a natural 7th E imply Major tonality. (F major)


"I don't wanna be a vampire. I'm a day person."


The chromatic sequence in the solo
from D to A# includes all the notes mentioned with
the inclusion of a flat 2nd F# (from F phyrgian)


dang ol mixin' and matchin'

As mentioned previously the mixing of major and minor
tonalities is commonplace in many forms of American
music.

A flat 3rd, flat 6th and flat 7th are common implications of minor tonality.


Bill S. Preston esquire
"We are in danger of flunking most heinously tomorrow
Ted."


Let's examine this a bit further..

If we take a look at F Ionian (F major)

F G A A# C D E

and we compare it to F Dorian

F G G# A# C D D#

We see the differences are a flat 3rd (G#) and a
flat 7th (D#)

<Dorian already sharpens the 6th of F Aeolian. That
is the difference between the 2 scales>

This may shed some more light on how the lines
of major and minor tonality are mixed.

In fact if ya take an Ionian scale and flatten the
3rd, 6th and 7th you have the Aeolian scale.


Bill S. Preston esquire
"We are destined to flunk most egregiously tomorrow, Ted."
Kenny






Arnold Ziffel **********movie star*******************

Easy Wind

The solo for Easy Wind is in E minor pentatonic.

E minor pentatonic E G A B D

with the addition of a natural 3rd G#

a natural 6th C#

and a flat 6th C

We'll see some mixing of minor and major tonalities
once again.

G# is the 3rd of E major.

E major chord E G# B

E minor chord E G B


This is the cornerstone of melding major and minor.

The natural 3rd (G#) is reiterated throughout the
solo by bending the G note on the 12th string on
the G string up a half step to G#.

There is also an instance where the 10th fret on the
A string is bent up one half step to (G#)


The majority of the solo takes place on frets 12-15
which is the 5th pattern of E minor pentatonic.


Players familiar with pentatonics will recognize these ideas as the blue notes.


<Hooterville crossing>

The additions of the flat 6th (C) and the 6th (C#)

is also playing with major and minor tonalities.

The flat 6th (C) is the 6th degree of E Aeolian

E Aeolian E F# G A B C D

The natural 6th (C#) is the 6th of E Ionian.

E Ionian E F# G# A B C# D#


<Betty Jo the Ho at the junction>


E Dorian also has the natural 6th as the Dorian
sharpens the 6th of the Aeolian scale.

E Dorian E F# G A B C# D

This all rather common manipulating of the pentatonic scale in a blues context.


OLiver Wendell Douglas better move to the city!
to the city where it all began.......