Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby RiverRat » Thu Jun 02, 2011 1:07 pm

playingdead wrote:until I went to two rack spaces, powered monitors, no pedals and one guitar cable :shock:


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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby jester536 » Thu Jun 02, 2011 1:11 pm

I gotta tell ya...after that lengthy description of exactly how you can put together the perfect rack...4 space...6 space...casters...dog ramp...
you gotta love how he drops in a half-sentence description of where he's at now.
That's exactly where I was at in 2009, except I had the Egnater M4 preamp and the Focus 2R power amp ... until I went to two rack spaces, powered monitors, no pedals and one guitar cable

Subtle...yet effective.
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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby playingdead » Thu Jun 02, 2011 1:26 pm

Well, you know ... it's pretty damn cool to have all that gear set up behind you on stage, looks like a real rock concert. And if I had a roadie to move it and set it all up, so much the better. But as you age ... sometimes less is more. Robben Ford shows up for gigs with a ZenDrive and waits for his rented Twin now, but I'll bet he hauled around stacks when he was younger. I'm past the age where I want to be lifting a Twin Reverb with a pair of E-120s in it. My Hard Truckers cabinet with the E-120s in it, and the road case, weighed 110 pounds. And lifting an MC-2300 ... fuggedabout it!

But it was really the volume issue that got to me, too loud onstage and still hard to hear in the midst of a volume war with everyone else getting louder to try and fend me off and hear themselves. Vicious cycle. Ask a band with an organist which they prefer onstage, a 240 lb. B3 with a real Leslie or 15 lb. Nord Electro? The Leslie sounds frigging unbelievable onstage, but it's also unbelievably loud. And if you've ever been in on lifting a B3 onto a stage, or God forbid, wrestling it up a flight of stairs, you know what I'm talking about.
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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby tapestry » Thu Jun 02, 2011 1:57 pm

I went from lots of gear to digital....Big speaker stacks to small earphones....I think I have tried everything in playing the last 25 - 30 years.

I always comes back to old (heavy) gear that just sound better to me. It is a hassle loading in sometimes. Tear down sucks too sometimes, but the moments that your actually playing your gear through a full rig setup are priceless to me and I wouldnt change anything - until I can no longer lug it myself. Maybe my kids would help me then ;)

To me, nothing sounds like the real deal, and for me that affects my playing. It might be too loud, so ill compensate by aiming the speaker at the back of my chest. But, to each his own and whatever works for you!
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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby mijknahs » Thu Jun 02, 2011 2:54 pm

I'm happy hauling my rig around. The heaviest piece is the 2x12 E120 cab. The MC100 is light (30 lbs) and the Twin head in a cabinet isn't that bad. The SMS is ridiculously light. Maybe 2 lbs? Plus with the MC100, you can get a good tone at lower volumes. Some people do it with an MC50 but I need a little more headroom.

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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby JonnyBoy » Thu Jun 02, 2011 3:45 pm

I have to note that my modded twin and my SMS sound kinda different. I like my SMS much better, it is focused and has been sounding better and better the more I play it. I have put some hours on it now, and I play it in a band setting about 4 times a week so it is breaking in nicely and quickly... I had to switch back to my twin for a couple of rehearsals and gigs and the difference was notable.
The twin has more emphasis on the highs and high mids than the SMS, which is something I don't miss.

The mac and the JBL's round out the tone proper, IMO. The SMS is very different through different cabs and amps, so the proof is positive. Those components are KEY in an analog system, I agree JBL E's are much easier to push and not worry about, my K-110's are brighter, but I have been warned a few times about their fragile nature. The E's sound just fine, and are actually Jerry's speaker of choice anyway.

Of coarse the guitar too with proper electronics. I promise a MC250, SMS and all the other killer gear you have will throw you where you want to be tone wise. You have a good Jerry feel and guitar, this would be like a ton of bricks once you try it. Aren't there some friends up your way with a rig like that you can try? That would be helpful. I have to say I like my MC100 better overhead wise, but I have yet to really use the full power behind it, and the MC250 gets PLENTY LOUD! Plus I like the fact the MC250 doesn't need fuses.

You are on the right track, If I was to build a Jerry rig for what I do and where I play again, I would use the same thing I have the second time around too. It just works!
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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby zambiland » Thu Jun 02, 2011 4:47 pm

jdsmodulus wrote:Keir go for the SMS! its light easy to use and spot on! You will not be dissappointed.


+1. No reason to lug around a heavy piece of gear where you going to have mod it, maintain it and lug it. The SMS is just exactly perfect.

Great for bass, too!
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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby mijknahs » Thu Jun 02, 2011 4:54 pm

Yeah, the SMS Classic is an impressive unit. It's hard to belive you can get real Fender Twin tone from a rack mounted unit.
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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby keirweir » Fri Jun 03, 2011 6:37 am

Vic that was a sick rig you had with the Egnator!

I'm starting to lean towards the SMS>Mac option. I heard the SMS is loaded with a Lexicon chip?

I've really been considering looking into Lexicon reverb units. I am trying to find that long decay Kimock style reverb.
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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby Pete B. » Fri Jun 03, 2011 7:49 am

With regard to "87' (pre)amp tone...
Waldos site notes the tone stack mods for "later" years (which would appear to give a notably different tone):
5.) Tone Stack ~ Early Alembicization used Stock values. Later Values were; Bass cap .022uf Polyester Film(Sprague 225p) / Mid Cap .022uF Polyester Film(Sprague 225p) / Treble Cap 250pF Silver Mica/ Bright Cap 120pF Silver Mica.
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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby Chuckles » Fri Jun 03, 2011 1:28 pm

Keir, I've got a modded Twin head I'd *love* to sell to you at a great price... but I gotta chime in with the others and say go for the SMS, man. It nails it, and yeah, the Lexicon is lush.

Also, +1 on Vic's comment on the cables. I went with the DIY Planet Waves stuff and it's been a huge headache... lost my Phase and DD last gig, which sucked.
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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby keirweir » Fri Jun 03, 2011 1:43 pm

I'm under the impression now it does not have a "Lexicon chip" but its still plush and based of a Hall setting.

Chuckles, feel free to PM your best offer!

SMS is sounding pretty sweet though
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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby tapestry » Fri Jun 03, 2011 1:55 pm

If I had and extra $700 laying around id get the sms, but since I already have a twin that I love the sound of, I dont see the point! I have other stuff to spend money on! BUT if i didnt have a modded twin, id be saving my pennies for the SMS for sure.

Now, if anyone wants to give me an SMS I would gladly use it and endorse it! ;)
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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby SarnoMusicSolutions » Sun Jun 05, 2011 8:43 am

The standard reverb module in the SMS Classic is made and designed by David Simpao at Nemesis Technologies. It's a custom "hall" reverb algorithm using the same high resolution (24bit) and the same or better build quality as Lexicon. But for the record, it's not actually a Lexicon module in there.

And thanks so much for all the great support for the SMS Classic preamp!!


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Re: Dreaming of my new guitar rig... Looking for 87 tone

Postby eric » Sun Jun 05, 2011 5:15 pm

SarnoMusicSolutions wrote:The standard reverb module in the SMS Classic is made and designed by David Simpao at Nemesis Technologies. It's a custom "hall" reverb algorithm using the same high resolution (24bit) and the same or better build quality as Lexicon. But for the record, it's not actually a Lexicon module in there


Curious as to the use of the Hall algorithm instead of typical Spring ?

Currently running a Lexicon MX300 with stereo spring reverb with decent results but this caught my eye.

Any insight ?
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