Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby keirweir » Mon Mar 28, 2011 9:53 am

Greetings... I have noticed over my last few gigs and even since I first started using an OBEL that when I engage the effects loop the signal is noticeably quieter that the direct to amp. This is completely understandable given all the cables and such but it’s become an issue with me when playing live.

For these reasons I just purchased a Boss graphic equalizer (that I basically got for the cost in sales tax through a company incentive program).
One of the big issues for me is playing clean with delay. I find that over the past couple gigs I would basically have to use my tube screamer to raise the signal. Another issue is using the overdrive. I have to turn it up to a point where I get some serious feedback.

So, where do I put this bad boy in the pedal chain? I assume as the first effect to raise everything?
Any help is appreciated.

P.S. I am sure having the band play quieter would help but we play it live and loud!
:cool:
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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby strumminsix » Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:02 am

Hey, last week on rukind we learned about the tone knob. Today is the volume knob :lol:

Have you thought about going old-school and rhythm at 6/7 with leads on 10?
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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby SarnoMusicSolutions » Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:03 am

Something about this symptom of a drop in level with the OBEL engaged doesn't sound right. When an OBEL is properly executed, there shouldn't be any noticeable drop when engaged like that. The EQ as a compensating boost sounds like a band-aid. Can you describe your entire OBEL setup, pedals, pot values, etc.??

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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby jdsmodulus » Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:30 am

Im thinking about adding the eq pedal as well. For some reason my guitar sounds great on the first 3 strings then it gets thin on the high 3 strings, G,B,E? I was hoping to even it out with the pedal. Not sure where I would put it in the chain, I have had these before. Also there seems to be a lot of mods done to these pedals can anyone suggest which is the best version?
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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby mkaufman » Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:34 am

Gary Brawer built me an external box which included a Waldo buffer. He commented that there's a volume drop when engaging the buffer, to which I agree. Not a big drop, however, I can tell it's there.

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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby waldo041 » Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:42 am

the buffer should really be onboard the guitar, but the trick to having both sides of the obel even without having to boost the obel side on, is to either true bypass each effect pedal in the chain or an audio switcher like the gcx. the mutron III gain knob in bypass mode can also raise the obel "on" side without having to add anything. this is how jerry worked around this issue before the cutler switcher arrived.

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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby playingdead » Mon Mar 28, 2011 11:25 am

He's probably having the same issue I had running all those effects in a chain on a pedalboard ... a little tone loss on a pedal or two brings down the overall volume.

I put the Boss EQ at the very end of the chain set flat with a slight bump in the output to equalize the two levels -- with all the effects switched off at the time. The EQ adds a little noise, though, can't avoid that. It's not a particularly quiet pedal itself.

Going to a GCX solved that problem permanently, and sounded soooo much better.
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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby keirweir » Mon Mar 28, 2011 12:11 pm

playingdead wrote:He's probably having the same issue I had running all those effects in a chain on a pedalboard ... a little tone loss on a pedal or two brings down the overall volume.

I put the Boss EQ at the very end of the chain set flat with a slight bump in the output to equalize the two levels -- with all the effects switched off at the time. The EQ adds a little noise, though, can't avoid that. It's not a particularly quiet pedal itself.

Going to a GCX solved that problem permanently, and sounded soooo much better.


You nailed it Vic! As a matter of fact it looks like am recreating your older issue on your old Pedalpad! I think I have an old picture you sent me right before I took the Pad off your hands showing the equalizer .

Its a very slight drop in volume and tone but noticable enough to me. Its always somthing!
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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby mijknahs » Mon Mar 28, 2011 12:18 pm

I'm using a normal pedalboard (signal going through all effects) and don't have that problem when effects are off. The signal level is the same with OBEL on or off.

You might have a particular pedal that is causing the problem. Or maybe a bad cable somewhere is giving a poor signal.

Try no effects (but still going througth the OBEL) and then add the effects one by one. I'm only using 4 pedals and most are true bypassed (the ones that aren't don't seem to matter).

The buffer is always on whether you're using the OBEL or not so that isn't the trouble.
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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby JonnyBoy » Mon Mar 28, 2011 12:25 pm

One question, where do you have the buffer pedal hooked into the chain? edit: if you have it in the mono line it is not buffering until it goes to the amp. if you have it in the stereo line, then it only goes through the OBEL. I may be wrong here, but Is that the case?

I am not an expert modder, but I ave looked into the GE7 mods pretty deep.

It looks like the IC chip changes will give you a quieter operation, there are a few copy cat versions of mods out there worth looking into, and all mention the same parts for replacement. I don't think they totally rid the noise but it will cut it in half at least, allowing you to be able to boost the volume a bit higher before it hisses. Some people think its a lot of work for little return. I have heard to make sure and use quality chips like Burr Brown if you do. Good Luck!
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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby mijknahs » Mon Mar 28, 2011 1:03 pm

To take full advantage of the buffer (not the EQ), it needs to be pre OBEL and the OBEL needs to be pre volume pot. Buffer is always on. Even when not using the OEBL.

I used to have a pedal that really sucked tone (mainly volume drop) when the effect was off (it wasn't true bypassed). I had to use an EQ pedal (the grey Boss one) as a boost to compensate for the volume drop of that pedal. I put it right after that pedal but I think it was the last pedal in the chain. That worked great but I ended up with a different pedal that didn't require the EQ boost (to simplify the chain).
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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby myoung6923 » Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:13 am

I also use a boss eq for a slight boost and put it just before the delay. I just set it so that the volume is identical with the loop on or off.
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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby strumminsix » Tue Mar 29, 2011 5:10 am

Dude, does your tone change?
If not a boost pedal is more transparent.
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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby SarnoMusicSolutions » Tue Mar 29, 2011 6:00 am

Agreed. A boost pedal is a much more clean and pure way to boost a signal than an EQ pedal which has MANY active stages and capacitors and general degradation of the signal quality.

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Re: Using an equalizer in the pedal chain to raise signal?

Postby strumminsix » Tue Mar 29, 2011 6:16 am

I have 2 catalinbread boosts and find both to be fantastic.
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