Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby wolftigerrosebud » Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:12 pm

I've been going through old threads here for days, and now that I've gathered up information on this, I'm ready to ask a question.

My situation is this: I'm borrowing a friend's Deluxe Reverb, and he's been kind enough to lend it to me for the second weekend in a row. Nevertheless, I need a new amp, and quick. I have to get it within 10 days, and I have $1000 to spend on it. The tone I want is not specifically a Jerry tone, but it's the same basic idea. I want the ringing highs and relatively clean tube sound specifically.

I was looking at Ebay and Craigslist, and found that I could pick up a Silverface Twin for $800 or under. There's even one on Ebay that is working except for the reverb (and it looks beat up and retolexed) for $500-something. If I got one of those, modded it to Blackface, and then replaced the speakers later on down the line, I think that'd come out around $1000. My concern with that, though, is that even the 22w Deluxe I've been using for rehearsals has bordered on being too loud, and I haven't turned it up past 5, so the Twin would probably be way too loud. That's why I've got some reservations about it going the Twin route; if I never turn the volume up past 3, will I even get the ring out of the aluminum domed speakers (Webers or Commonwealths or some other JBL-like speaker), or will it just be a total waste of size?

My other thought was that I could pick up a used Hot Rod Deluxe or Blues Deluxe and put a Neomag and some quality preamp tubes in it, but I'm not sure if I'll still experience the early breakup that those amps have (is that just the stock speaker, or is it the circuit as well?), and even if I don't, the components in the modern Fenders aren't as high quality as the vintage ones. Printed circuit boards may have an effect on this; I don't know.

If I had money or time to save up for it, I'd love an SMS Classic with a power amp and 1x12, but I don't.

Ideally, I'd like a smallish combo that's appropriate for rehearsals and small clubs, but not as small as a Princeton, that is pretty clean throughout the range of its volume, and that gives me that bell-like ringing tone. Any thoughts or suggestions on amps, speakers, or components will be greatly appreciated. Thanks, all.
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby golfnutt » Tue Feb 15, 2011 7:16 pm

Ideally, I'd like a smallish combo that's appropriate for rehearsals and small clubs, but not as small as a Princeton, that is pretty clean throughout the range of its volume, and that gives me that bell-like ringing tone. Any thoughts or suggestions on amps, speakers, or components will be greatly appreciated. Thanks, all.


This would pretty much rule out a Twin imho a silver face pro reverb is probobly the ticket for you.
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby mijknahs » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:33 pm

I don't know why but I never could have the volume and headroom I need with a Deluxe Reverb. A Twin is just right for me. I play it with the volume at about 5 or 6 but then my guitar volume is not all the way up either (maybe 2/3 up) with a UGB.
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby wolftigerrosebud » Wed Feb 16, 2011 6:57 am

What if I used a power attenuator for the Twin? And man, I wish I had a unity gain buffer. I have a pretty nice axe, but it's got a regular old volume pot.

Yeah, Mij, the Deluxe was breaking up for me too fast, too. When you've got your Twin about halfway up, do you get any of that ringing tone from the speakers? Or do you have your speakers set up differently? My concern is that I'd need the speakers to be moving a lot of air to get the sound I want.

Edit: This is the Twin I'm looking at picking up. Has the Blackface mods done to it already, and it still has the Master Volume: http://miami.craigslist.org/mdc/msg/2181565753.html
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby strumminsix » Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:12 am

wolftigerrosebud wrote:Edit: This is the Twin I'm looking at picking up. Has the Blackface mods done to it already, and it still has the Master Volume: http://miami.craigslist.org/mdc/msg/2181565753.html

Firstly, BF can mean 10 different things to 10 different techs. Secondly, it's not BF it has an MV

My best advice would be to pickukp a Fender DR RI from craigslist and save up for what you want.
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby wolftigerrosebud » Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:45 am

Unfortunately, there aren't any for sale in my area. Nevertheless, I could pick one up for around 700 on ebay, it looks like. What if I were to stick a Weber Neomag 12 or a Tone Tubby 40/40 in there? Would a 12" Neomag work well in a DRRI? The stock speaker is a 50w Jensen, and the one I've been playing out of I'm not that crazy about. The 75w Weber would give me more headroom (a good thing, because clean's what I'm after, and I've got one of Brad's awesome Earth Drive pedals for when I want something else), but I just don't know if I'd get that ringing high end out of it. I'd also be worried about damaging the transformer by giving it too much headroom.
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby strumminsix » Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:56 am

wolftigerrosebud wrote:Unfortunately, there aren't any for sale in my area. Nevertheless, I could pick one up for around 700 on ebay, it looks like. What if I were to stick a Weber Neomag 12 or a Tone Tubby 40/40 in there? Would a 12" Neomag work well in a DRRI? The stock speaker is a 50w Jensen, and the one I've been playing out of I'm not that crazy about. The 75w Weber would give me more headroom (a good thing, because clean's what I'm after, and I've got one of Brad's awesome Earth Drive pedals for when I want something else), but I just don't know if I'd get that ringing high end out of it. I'd also be worried about damaging the transformer by giving it too much headroom.


The speaker isn't breaking up in that amp so you won't get more headroom from that. However if the Weber is more efficient than the Jensen you would but I don't think it's that much more efficient.

You aren't giving you amp more headroom so that is a non-issue. The only way to trash a transformer is with a Decepticon. Other than that you can damage it by running it without a load or a mistmatched load which you aren't doing.

Get your amp off the floor a few feet and 2 things will happen:
1. You'll hear it and 22 watts will be plenty loud for most happenings
2. The low end will drop some which open up the mids and the highs will be clearer
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby mijknahs » Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:22 am

I didn't like the Weber NeoMag. Way brighter and thinner sounding than a JBL E120 or K120.
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby wolftigerrosebud » Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:46 am

That's good to know... And funny about the Decepticon. Even if I get a used DRRI, I'd want to replace the stock speaker, but at that point it's getting close to 1000 bucks, and if this is basically going to be a fill-in while I save up for the SMS rig, that seems kind of expensive...

I know the Blues Deluxe and Hot Rod Deluxe get pretty mixed reviews, but the price is right. I could pick up a used one and stick in a better speaker and have only spent 600 bucks. I'm starting to think that might be the better option. I've played both of them minimally, and I don't hear a huge difference between them and the DRRI. They both have ice-picky highs and are sort of one dimensional sounding. That's why I'd replace the speakers and probably the tubes on any of those 3 options, but after the upgrades would I be missing out on something by going with a HRD or Blues Deluxe over a DRRI?
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby tigerstrat » Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:54 am

Blues Deluxe is a very decent amp. Very nice cleans with some dirty versatility.
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby strumminsix » Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:06 am

wolftigerrosebud wrote: I could pick up a used one and stick in a better speaker and have only spent 600 bucks. I'm starting to think that might be the better option. I've played both of them minimally, and I don't hear a huge difference between them and the DRRI. They both have ice-picky highs and are sort of one dimensional sounding. That's why I'd replace the speakers and probably the tubes on any of those 3 options, but after the upgrades would I be missing out on something by going with a HRD or Blues Deluxe over a DRRI?


If I were you I'd go cheap now, save, gig, and buy better later and use whatever you have now as a backup.

Harsh highs can usually be tamed with turning down the highs and the MIDS so the highs shine through easier.

One dimensional is the result of the design and components.
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby JonnyBoy » Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:10 am

our new rhythm player was using a blues Jr last night and was louder than he needed to be, plus about twice as loud as we normally gig at stage volume. I guess it depends on how loud you guys play.... I am a firm believer in a low as possible stage volume and let the FOH be the main volume, or for smaller places play as low as you can. People seem to enjoy the music better when we keep the volume reasonable. Again, that also depends on the place, age of the crowd, size of the venue, how loud your drummer insists on playng. so many variables.
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby wolftigerrosebud » Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:22 am

We generally play louder than I'd like to. Loud enough that if I don't wear earplugs, I'll have substantial hearing loss and ringing in my ears for the rest of the night and perhaps the next day as well. Too damn loud.

But hey, I can't help it if they refuse to play softer. Anyway, what I'm thinking now is that I might go with a Blues Deluxe with a Neomag 12 w/ aluminum dust cap and cloth cones. I hope that'll give me a sound that I'm at least marginally happy with. I like a bright, smooth sound, and I assume that the Blues Deluxe is a pretty mid heavy amp, being a blues combo and all, so hopefully the Webers will work well in it.
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby strumminsix » Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:27 am

JonnyBoy wrote:our new rhythm player was using a blues Jr last night and was louder than he needed to be, plus about twice as loud as we normally gig at stage volume. I guess it depends on how loud you guys play.... I am a firm believer in a low as possible stage volume and let the FOH be the main volume, or for smaller places play as low as you can. People seem to enjoy the music better when we keep the volume reasonable. Again, that also depends on the place, age of the crowd, size of the venue, how loud your drummer insists on playng. so many variables.

I share that philosophy but my bandmates don't. I finally said last gig- look at the people dancing. No one in front of the stage for 10 feet. they were dancing 30 feet away.


wolftigerrosebud wrote:We generally play louder than I'd like to. Loud enough that if I don't wear earplugs, I'll have substantial hearing loss and ringing in my ears for the rest of the night and perhaps the next day as well. Too damn loud.

But hey, I can't help it if they refuse to play softer. Anyway, what I'm thinking now is that I might go with a Blues Deluxe with a Neomag 12 w/ aluminum dust cap and cloth cones. I hope that'll give me a sound that I'm at least marginally happy with. I like a bright, smooth sound, and I assume that the Blues Deluxe is a pretty mid heavy amp, being a blues combo and all, so hopefully the Webers will work well in it.


That's stupidly loud.



I say this again and again. When bands play ridiculously loud they loose dynamics unless you have a BIG stage to really
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Re: Silverface Twin or Something Else?

Postby wolftigerrosebud » Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:53 am

I'm with you. My bandmates are all kind of on the oblivious side, even if they're well-meaning, and they just can't seem to be told to turn down. This whole weekend I could barely hear the keyboardist's synth and his vocals, but the bassist and other guitarist keep turning up. Then, when I turn down to try to give them a queue, they don't pick up on it or choose to ignore it, and I'm playing so softly that I can't hear myself for 10 minutes. Shit.
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