Jerry using an Mc2100??

[tigerstrat]

Can you point out this supposed Mutron use?? Where/when is that sound you're debating?

Brad, I think Jerry is using the light bandpass filter in many of the lead parts of Eyes, esp audible around 3:20-4:15, and in the first solo starting around 5:45 or so... and of course Dancin' is chock full of it, with the fuzzy Octave thrown in, about where you said. The supposed Mu almost sounds like it could be a fairly rapid Phase effect, but if you listen to the individual notes they have too much consistency of attack/release for it to be a phase. It's the 1976 "chirpy" sound!

[mkaufman]

Mutron in June '76? Too early, no?

mk

Why?

I could be totally off base here, however, what are the earliest examples of JG playing a Mutron? I thought he started in 1977 w/ Estimated (is 2/26 the first one??). If earlier, please show me some examples.

mk

[waldo041]

The change of clothes is probably because the video is from soundcheck and the shot is from the show.

Can you point out this supposed Mutron use?? Where/when is that sound you're debating?


Brad

MC2100.jpg

Brad,

the change in clothes from picture to video is because of they are over a month apart. check out my earlier post.

as for the mu3, it can definately be heard at the cow palace new years eve show dec 31,1976 during one of the jams. i'll have to go back and check out which one, but need to defer to TS as to dates on it's earlier use. keith can be seen using a mutron phaser in 75, so musitronics was on the map for them as early as that.

peace,
waldo

[waldo041]

i downloaded the entire video of July 12, 1976, and upon further examination, definately an MC2100. i can make out the cap cans inbetween the heatsinks, and i can also see 2 knobs in some photos from june 1976. do you think he was running one 2 -12" cab off the MC2100 fed from the MC3500?

peace,
waldo

[mkaufman]

Mutron @ Cow Palace: it's possible - could be that JG was just starting to work with the unit. I suspect they were already working on some Terrapin songs.

However... June '76?? Still have my doubts. I've been listening to '76 shows since '76(!) and I don't recall the Mutron sound back then. Of course, he may have been testing one during soundchecks...

mk

[waldo041]

check out this june 76 dancin jam, at around 4:20 thru. i believe this is the mutron octave divider and he is also using the green ringer function.

http://www.archive.org/details/gd1976-0 ... sbeok.shnf


peace,
waldo

[tigerstrat]

Mutron @ Cow Palace: it's possible - could be that JG was just starting to work with the unit. I suspect they were already working on some Terrapin songs.

However... June '76?? Still have my doubts. I've been listening to '76 shows since '76(!) and I don't recall the Mutron sound back then. Of course, he may have been testing one during soundchecks...

mk

Maybe because it's nothing even close to the "classic" Low-pass filter sound that Garcia became associated with. To my ears, there is Band-pass filter with a very low Peak setting, making each note warble or chirp on it's own arc (not a phase oscillating in the background) ...to my ears.

You know, it may have taken some trial and error for JG to arrive at the holy grail Mutron low-pass tone so many players (and pedal builders) are chasing. Given Garcia's penchant for "stability" over novelty, it makes sense he would start cautiously with the settings on a gonzo device like the M3, esp w/o benefit of the OBEL. He might have hit on the LP sound early on but found it too difficult to control. Or maybe he wanted a very subtle phase-like enhancement that kept each note very defined and clear sounding. Is that you just don't hear any effect on the guitar at all, or you think it's a Phase or a Wah or ... "Insect Fear"?

Trust your ears more than what is "written" somewhere. Most of the people that gathered this information are right here on this board (or still on Gearheads- the stubborn ones ), and will be quick to tell you that the info is still highly incomplete and subject to correction and change, esp as you get back into the 70's, n/m the 60's.

[tigerstrat]

Sorry about jacking the thread!

I never even saw the 2100 on the cab! The black grill largely blends in with the background. The 3500 is hard to miss in the still photo though. Perhaps they just ran out of milk crates and needed something to raise the Boogies off of the floor...

[waldo041]

Maybe because it's nothing even close to the "classic" Low-pass filter sound that Garcia became associated with. To my ears, there is Band-pass filter with a very low Peak setting, making each note warble or chirp on it's own arc (not a phase oscillating in the background) ...to my ears.

You know, it may have taken some trial and error for JG to arrive at the holy grail Mutron low-pass tone so many players (and pedal builders) are chasing. Given Garcia's penchant for "stability" over novelty, it makes sense he would start cautiously with the settings on a gonzo device like the M3, esp w/o benefit of the OBEL. He might have hit on the LP sound early on but found it too difficult to control. Or maybe he wanted a very subtle phase-like enhancement that kept each note very defined and clear sounding. Is that you just don't hear any effect on the guitar at all, or you think it's a Phase or a Wah or ... "Insect Fear"?

i agree TS, the mu3 is a finicky pedal outside of the OBEL type of setup. the obel really breaks that horse, but those without very quickly find out they either need a volume pedal or eq after it to try and tame it. that said, jerry didn't have jerry to base his mu3 sound or settings off of.

peace,
waldo