Troubleshooting OBEL

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Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby jkstraw » Fri Jul 02, 2010 8:30 pm

I just picked up a new guitar with the OBEL and it is either messing with my setup or my mind :?

I thought I would appeal to this group because some of you run similar setups. Mine consists of a OBEL equipped guitar, hubbub, axefx and SMS Classic.

I am using Vic's patch and general connections as discussed here: viewtopic.php?f=309&t=6547&p=77887&hilit=axefx+obel#p77887 (note I am bypassing the Amp and Cabs, and using the SMS Classic/McIntosh + 2x12 instead)

Here is a breakdown of the wiring and a pic (wish I could figure out a better way to explain it!)

Guitar mono out -> Hubbub ('guitar')
Guitar OBEL st. out -> Hubbub ('OBEL')
Hubbub ('Send') -> AxeFx input 1
Hubbub ('Return') -> Axefx output 1
Hubbub ('Amp') -> AxeFx input 2
AxeFX output 2 -> SMS Classic In
SMS Classic Out -> RC-50 Looper In
RC-50 Looper out -> MC2105 in => Speakers

wiring.jpg
wiring.jpg (58.9 KiB) Viewed 786 times


With the wiring above I get no signal on the axe-fx at all (i.e. input 1 is not receiving a signal from the hubbub 'send'). I can hook up the guitar's standard output to input 1 and get sound, I am going to grab a Y cable asap so I can bypass the Hubub and confirm the OBEL is working but in the meantime does anyone have any thoughts?
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby JonnyBoy » Sat Jul 03, 2010 12:22 am

Do you think its in the guitar?? or the Hub? has it never worked?
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby jkstraw » Sat Jul 03, 2010 4:41 am

I am thinking hubbub - but only based on the statement that all electronics on the guitar were reviewed by Brawer this week. I think I will get the multimeter out and do some continuity tests (not sure why I didn't think of that before!).
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby bcresci » Sat Jul 03, 2010 5:56 am

Deja vu. I was having very similar trouble last week. Turns out for my OBEL problem, it was the stereo jack doing the effects send that was the issue. I had the ring and sleeve reversed - so the OBEL jack wasn't sending to the Hub Bub properly. But if I tested each component by iteself, everything seemd to work, but when put together I got nothing from the OBEL.

My guess is that it's not the Hub Bub - it's just too simple of a box, and Godfrey tests them before he sends them. I would look hard at the guitar wiring. Or perhaps some setting on the Axe that might turn off a send or receive?

A couple of trouble-shooting things to try:

Does this setup work when the OBEL on the guitar is bypassed? If so, the trouble might be the wiring on the OBEL jack.
Remove the Axe from the setup and go straight into the SMS / Amp or Combo amp. Does the chain work in OBEL and bypass mode without the Axe?

Basically, I'd just start plugging and playing with various components until you isolate what might be the trouble. Start simple and then layer pieces in.
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby bcresci » Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:00 am

By the way, why are you going back into the Axe from the 'Amp' out on the Hub Bub? Are you doing any additional processing in the Axe the second time through? If not, then I might suggest going from the Hub Bub's Amp out jack straight into the SMS. Do all your Axe processing as part of the effects loop on the guitar. This might be a good way to make sure the Axe In / Out 2 jacks aren't the issue.
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby hogan » Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:33 am

After you test the hubbub and guitar by themselves w/ a conventional amp setup to prove the hubbub and guitar are getting along w/ each other try this:
guitar mono to guitar in on hub
guitar obel to obel in on hub
Send from hub to input 1 on axe
return on hub to output 2 on axe
amp on hub to in 2 on axe
output 1 on axe to SMS
SMS output to Mac
Mac to cab

Make sure you have the hub switch in the right position. Make sure you have the axe inputs set to analogue rear.
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby jkstraw » Sat Jul 03, 2010 9:20 am

Thanks for the help guys - I am more confused than ever now :oops:

I have tested continuity of each cable, both alone and through the hubub and everything looks good - so hear is the weird part. I can take any standard mono cable from my mono guitar output (with OBEL bypassed) plug it straight in to the SMS Classic or AxeFX and I am 100%. If I plug the guitar mono o

Gtr out (OBEL bypass) -> SMS in = 100%

Gtr out (OBEL bypass) -> hubbub gtr in -> hubub amp out -> SMS = no sound (but there is continuity when tested! :shock: )

I am not even sure how that is possible :-) So at the moment I am not even adding the OBEL in to the equation. I am going to call the builder to see if I am missing something :-)

Thanks again guys.
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby bcresci » Sat Jul 03, 2010 9:30 am

In the second scenario you listed, make sure the Hub Bub toggle switch is left (the one with five full fingers). If you're still pointed at Jerry's hand, the Hub Bub will be expecting sound into the OBEL. That might cause a problem, but maybe not. Something to check.
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby jkstraw » Sat Jul 03, 2010 9:36 am

bcresci wrote:In the second scenario you listed, make sure the Hub Bub toggle switch is left (the one with five full fingers). If you're still pointed at Jerry's hand, the Hub Bub will be expecting sound into the OBEL. That might cause a problem, but maybe not. Something to check.


Ya I tried that as well (actually tried both sides in case it was wired incorrectly). I think my only option now is to grab a Y cable and bypass the hubbub all together and see if that works. When I leave the OBEL out of the equation it is definitely the hubbub causing the issue (because straight to the SMS and/or AxeFX works 100%).

I appreciate the help - I'll reach out to Godfrey as well.
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby jkstraw » Sat Jul 03, 2010 3:34 pm

I went out and picked up a 1/4" TRS stereo ==> 2x 1/4" mono Y cable this afternoon. Hooked everything up (sans hubbub) and everything worked 100%. I guess I'll touch base with Godfrey to get his take on the problem and troubleshooting options.

Thanks all.
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby waldo041 » Sun Jul 04, 2010 5:39 am

jkstraw wrote:I went out and picked up a 1/4" TRS stereo ==> 2x 1/4" mono Y cable this afternoon. Hooked everything up (sans hubbub) and everything worked 100%. I guess I'll touch base with Godfrey to get his take on the problem and troubleshooting options.

Thanks all.


in the past few months there have been a few guys who use the OBEL schems available that the hubbub did not jive with. the remedy for those guys was the swap of the tip and ring of the stereo jack for the OBEL on their guitars. Godfrey should check into matching HIS obel stereo jack up with the schems most guy's are using his product with, or at least ask them if there Tip=Send and their Ring=Return when purchasing his product.

sounds like you may be having the same trouble.

peace,
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby jkstraw » Sun Jul 04, 2010 6:11 am

Thanks waldo - I have send an email out to Godfrey - I hope he can help me make the required changes to the hubbub- as a novice gearhead - working on the pedal seems a lot easier than the guts of my Tiger!
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby hogan » Sun Jul 04, 2010 8:20 am

This is super easy to test for. just hook up the hubbub from your guitar into a conventional amp w/ one effect in the loop but instead of the jack labeled send go from the return and came back to the send jack. Basically swap the send and return. if this solves your problem open up the box and unscrew the nut from the send and return jacks, carefully back them out of the holes and put them in the proper ones. There should be enough wire to allow this. Good luck
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby jkstraw » Sun Jul 04, 2010 8:34 am

Thanks guys,

My guess is there is a bigger issue with the hubbub - even when I take the OBEL out of the equation I can't get a signal. I tested with a plain old guitar, a single effect and the hubbub set to '5-finger- mode' and still no dice. I'll report back when I have heard from Godfrey.

P.S. Hogan I did try your suggestion as well - cheers.
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Re: Troubleshooting OBEL

Postby jkstraw » Fri Oct 01, 2010 5:53 pm

Wow what a bad trip. Picture is worth a thousand words.....
cable_bad.JPG
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Continuity between the tip and sleeve really isn't good for anyone :?
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