Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby Chuckles » Thu Feb 04, 2010 6:26 am

I can't speak to the difference in tone, but it's a difference of 20 vs 14 lbs/speak. 12 pounds might not seem like a lot, but when you're at the threshold of weight you can comfortably carry yourself, it makes a difference. I simply can't carry my 2X12 with the E120s in them any more. Bad back and shoulder. Thank God for understanding and compassionate bandmates!

Too bad... there was just a pair of Ks on ebay that went pretty cheap...
Seems like I've been here before...

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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby jeffm725 » Thu Feb 04, 2010 7:35 am

this can easily be looked up, but I am lazy, so I can be off base again, but it has been my understanding that E's are ceramic and K's are alnico (or a portion is alnico), D's are definitely alnico.....there are tons of opinions and studies on the properites of alnico vs. the properties of ceramic and the resulting "sound and feel" of the driver.

By the way, as we know E's handle just a ridiculous amount of power for an instrument speaker.....but don't let that fool you into thinking that K's are "low" power. K's can also handle a fantastic amount of power, (not on an E level, but huge nevertheless)

I have a single K-120 in a 100 watt Boogie mark2a, anyone familiar with Boogies knows that once you engage the gain channel there are obscene amounts of power available, where you cannot turn the master past 3 without shattering Windows. The power available makes a Twin look like a Champ.
Anyway, the single K can handle EVERYTHING the Boogie throws at it and then some.
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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby hogan » Thu Feb 04, 2010 8:10 am

The E's are really kind of hype job. I wish JG never used them so I wouldn't have to convince people that there much more sensible options. I've made cabs for guys and the whole time i'm telling them it's going to be heavy as hell and they all assure me it's no big deal and that it's worth it. I ship the cab and they are stoked but the first thing out of their mouths is "boy this thing sure is heavy for a 2X12", nevermind a 3x12.
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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby RiverRat » Thu Feb 04, 2010 8:20 am

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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby jonarobb » Thu Feb 04, 2010 9:11 am

In 1975 Jerry was using a combination of D120-F's and K120's. Seems like when a D120 would blow at this point JBL's contemporary replacement at the time was the K120. There are some nice shots from Bob Weir's studio during the making of Blues For Allah and all the Cabs and Combos are loaded quite clearly with K120's.

The first version of the E120 wasn't made available until 1979. Fender was offering upgrades in their 1979 catalog to the "All New JBL E120" for Twin Reverbs. They don't show up in JBL's catalogs until 1980.
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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby mijknahs » Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:41 am

If you like the mid to late 70's sound, go with the K120s. Don't use Super 2s either. Just use your favorite single coils or even Dual Sounds.

If you want that 80's sound, the E120s and Super 2s. And a single 1x12 cab is plent for most smaller venues (about as heavy as the Twin head). Mic it for larger venues. If you don't care, then it doesn't matter. Personally, I like the sound of the E120s and Super 2s. For tone, '82-'84 is my favorite. The low string "burps" and hard open A chords are amazing. I don't hear that in the 70's.

Jim
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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby SarnoMusicSolutions » Thu Feb 04, 2010 12:10 pm

The DiMarzios split to single coil were a gift from heaven to Jerry. That brought IT out of his sound in a huge way. Both the meatier Dual Sounds and the thinner, brighter Super II's. Nothing like it.

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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby 2252garcia » Thu Feb 04, 2010 2:04 pm

I am in contact with the person who reconed Jerry's speakers and he states that at least in the later years they were in fact E120's.
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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby 2252garcia » Thu Feb 04, 2010 2:10 pm

CrispyTapes wrote:I was able to scoop up 3 of Jer's E120's at the Ramrod auction, so I do know that is what he had stocked up.....the E120 brochures in the boxes were dated 1984 btw


I bid on those as well. If you don't mind telling,what did they go for?
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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby jeffm725 » Thu Feb 04, 2010 2:29 pm

mijknahs wrote:If you like the mid to late 70's sound, go with the K120s. Don't use Super 2s either. Just use your favorite single coils or even Dual Sounds.

If you want that 80's sound, the E120s and Super 2s. And a single 1x12 cab is plent for most smaller venues (about as heavy as the Twin head). Mic it for larger venues. If you don't care, then it doesn't matter. Personally, I like the sound of the E120s and Super 2s. For tone, '82-'84 is my favorite. The low string "burps" and hard open A chords are amazing. I don't hear that in the 70's.

Jim

I believe you have to divide up qualification the "mid- late 70's" sound even more, due to the Bean. Those Bean pickups had a very different sound than both Dual sounds and super 2's . Dual sounds (in reality just 4 conductor Super distortions) are not that far from Super 2's. Super 2's just favor the top end a little more.
It is my opinion that the Bean pickups vs. either Dimarzio flavor had more effect on the tone change than K120 vs. e120 did.
So mid late 70's should be two categories:
mid late 70's/Bean
midlate 70's/Wolf
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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby waldo041 » Thu Feb 04, 2010 2:45 pm

blaster, exception the TB500 WITH effects loop and Wolf with No effects loop switch.


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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby CrispyTapes » Thu Feb 04, 2010 2:46 pm

Jeez, I forget now what the final price was, but I think it was like $1200 w/ the auction fees. I figured $400 per Jer speaker wasnt' too bad! The fun part was picking them up and then getting to re-check all the stuff from the auction...there was so much great stuff. that garcia case with his strings and picks, the Live/Dead art.. ah man. I would have ended up scooping up Jer's tweed champ but Bonhams forgot to put my bid in... classic. but, I was able to get keith's wall of sound cab though, as they mis-labeled it in the catalog so no one knew it took 12" speakers. So I pair that up with one of Weir's front-vented cabs that i got via Ken Babbs and you get an interesting mix of tones: sealed back, and front vented. Paired with a open backed Hart Trucker JG-4 and you have air going every which way!

To be honest, I'm really bummed all Ramrod (and all the deads gear) didn't end up at Terrapin. They really dropped that ball. Big time. I mean, they even fund raised for it and Willie Brown (SF's mayor) found a site for them on the bay. San Francisco is PRIME for a GD museum of some sort.. would have been so great to have all that gear reassembled and put back to life for generations to come.....oh well. Impermanence.
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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby mijknahs » Thu Feb 04, 2010 3:12 pm

JeffM725,

Do you know when the Bean was in use and when he went back to Wolf? Did he have the Dual Sounds in the Wolf when he first got it back in the late 70's?

Also, I wonder what someone would do if they really wanted to get something close to the Bean sound (besides getting a Travis Bean). What kind of currently available pickups would one try for. I bet there are some people out there who really love that '77 tone and want to try to get close to that.

Jim
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Re: Did Jerry really ever use E120's??

Postby tigerstrat » Thu Feb 04, 2010 3:25 pm

jonarobb wrote:There are some nice shots from Bob Weir's studio during the making of Blues For Allah and all the Cabs and Combos are loaded quite clearly with K120's.


oh yes, forgot about the Mesa w K120 in that 1975 shot.
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