Wiring Pickups "Out of Phase"

Postby strumminsix » Thu Dec 13, 2007 6:51 pm

Dozin wrote:I bought a Dean Markley preamp like Weir used during the 85-89 era. I have a picture of him using it and the presence control is set at around 7. I don't think it distorts at all it just get's extremly bright if you crank up the presence. I run the amp hot too, master volume and preamp around 8.


Very cool, Dozin! Is it tube or solid state? Assuming SS.
If so presence is simply higher than treble and there we agree.
But if tube it is negative feedback from the powertubes.
In that case it does have tone control but also other 'sounds'.
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Postby Dozin » Thu Dec 13, 2007 7:23 pm

The Dean Markley Preamp offers both tube and transistorized selection. The tube section consists of 1 12AX7 tube while the transistorized offers a complete F.E.T. system with a push of a button. I like the tube section a little bit better than the F.E.T.

I also own the same unit in a combo amp. It's a little different than the strictly preamp version. As a combo amp it's just that a amp. Or you can pull the unit out of the combo and stick it in a rack and run it as a preamp. I use to do this but I finally found the preamp version and keep that in the rack. The Dean Markley replaced my IVP and Mesa Boogie, it absolutely rocks!
Last edited by Dozin on Thu Dec 13, 2007 8:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby strumminsix » Thu Dec 13, 2007 8:08 pm

Ah, preamp tubes only. Nice! So the presence is just higher than the treble. Very cool!


Really, the DM for both electric and acoustic???
Had an IVP and hated it so much - never good tone for me.

Lovin' vintage Fenders for that early Bobby sound.
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Postby Dozin » Thu Dec 13, 2007 8:14 pm

Fender Acoustasonic for acoustic. Love that amp too :lol:
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Postby mkaufman » Mon Dec 31, 2007 10:24 pm

Dozin, et al.

I'm the guy with the AR500. Just to clarify, it has Ibanez Super 80 pickups. There a special variety called trisound Super 80's, because they have 4 wires so they can be wired for humbucker, single coil & phase reversal.

I also have a Cowboy, however, it has three Dimarzio pickups. I make a distinction between what I call the first generation Cowboy with Ibanez pickups and the 2nd generation Cowboy with Dimarzio pickups.

btw...does anyone know what type of single coil pickup was in Weir's early Ibanez guitars??

Thanks,
mk
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Postby Dozin » Tue Jan 01, 2008 6:18 am

Michael,

Edwin told me that he had a interview with Weir were he said it was a HI A pickup. If you look at this picture http://dozin.com/bobs/interview/custom.html I think it's a DiMarzio. I would try the SDS-1.

I put a SDS-1 in my Blackknife just to try it and the pickup sounded great.
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Postby mkaufman » Tue Jan 01, 2008 9:04 am

The Hi-A pup was made in the 70's - may not be easy to find and may not be RWRP.

Regarding the SDS-1, according to the Dimarzio website:

- it's not hum-cancelling: that's good because I need to it cancel hum when run in conjunction with the other pickup.

- ...the highs are less exaggerated and the bottom is deeper than most singes for a rounder, darker tone... (not sure if that's good or bad...)

- recommended for bridge position (therefore, I doubt that they ave a middle position (ie: RWRP) version of this pup??)

- introduced in 1978 (what was Weir using '75-'78??)

- DC Resistance is 8.68 (that may be good for matching to what I have now).

What else do you know about the SDS-1? Why does this on come to mind?

More info anyone??

tnx,
mk
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Postby mkaufman » Tue Jan 01, 2008 9:14 am

Chris:

Regarding the picture in your link:

To me, that's Cowboy "generation 2" in which Weir has changed from Ibanez pickups to Dimarzio pickups. The Dimarzio's are completely different animals from the Ibanez pickups and I don't think what was done in "gen 2" is applicable to a "gen 1" Cowboy which is what I'm trying to build.

btw...the 're-issue' Cowboy has a Dimarzio Virtual Vintage pickup in the middle.

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Postby jenkins » Tue Jan 01, 2008 4:42 pm

what exaclty does "out of phase" mean? ive hear the term hundreds of times and never really knew.

also, it sounds to me like u guys have the treble/bass/mids set way to low on your amps. if u are running the highs and bass @ 2 and the mids high I cant see it sounding very good.
The way I would do it is to set bass/treble/highs all at 10. than if i wanted less bass and highs I cut them by lowering down to arond 7.
After I started running my tone controls high I got MUCh better tones out of my amps. I feel you should be able to recreate all of bobby's different tones using one high quality amp that is set right and adjusted for the different tones.

For years I spent thousands of dollars on equiptment trying to get jerrry and bobby tones out of my guitar. But the problem was me, i wasn't good enough at playing or settig up my amps. Now that I know how to play well I can recreate bobby's tone with almost any amp. and now i have a few thousand dollars worth of effects and guitars collecting dust. now i just use dual amps, a tube screamer, an ibanez phase tone, and a delay pedal and I can recreate basically any guitar sound from the dead.

Listen to the dead from the melkweg in amsterdam after one of their europe tours. They were on all borrowed instruments, amps, etc. and they all still sounded like themselves.
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Postby Dozin » Tue Jan 01, 2008 7:31 pm

mkaufman wrote:Chris:

Regarding the picture in your link:

To me, that's Cowboy "generation 2" in which Weir has changed from Ibanez pickups to Dimarzio pickups. The Dimarzio's are completely different animals from the Ibanez pickups and I don't think what was done in "gen 2" is applicable to a "gen 1" Cowboy which is what I'm trying to build.

btw...the 're-issue' Cowboy has a Dimarzio Virtual Vintage pickup in the middle.

mk


The first generation cowboy had the sliding middle pickup. I don't believe I've seen flying fingers in that guitar. Only the 2681 modded one. The SDS1 is the single coil that Jerry used. I put it in my guitar with the Bartolini's in it and I was pleasantly surprised how clean and bright it is. It matched up well with the middle pickup in my guitar. That pickups definitely sings.
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Postby mkaufman » Tue Jan 01, 2008 8:03 pm

Chris:

Yes, the modded 2681 has Super 80's plus the sliding single coil.

If you look at the The Cowboy in your link above, there's no fancy inlay under the bridge. This is the 2nd Cowboy.

The first Cowboy had an even fancier inlay, and included the Ibanez Super 80 pickups. I have some pics. Here's one (if it works) from 12/31/76:



You can clearly see the Super 80 Flying Finger pickup in the neck position. I'll see if I have more pics...

The chronology, give or take, as I understand it is:

1) modded blonde ash 2681, Ibanez Super 80's with sliding single coil, no EQ

2) Cowboy generation 1: dark stained ash with VERY fancy inlay (see pic above), Ibanez Super 80's, single coil, NO EQ (yes - first Cowboy had no EQ!)

1977: Ibanez introduces Steve Miller 2622 EQ model guitar. EQ/Pre-amp is added to Cowboy gen 1 guitar.

4) Cowboy generation 2: dark stained ash, fancy inlay (but less fancy than Cowboy generation 1), Dimarzio HB's plus single coil. This is the Cowboy that Ibanez reissued in 2005.

Along the way, others were made, some without any inlay other than tree of life.

mk
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Postby mkaufman » Tue Jan 01, 2008 8:10 pm

Ugh...how does one upload photos???

Chris: I'll email you the photo. Please post if possible.

tnx,
mk[/img]
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Postby Dozin » Tue Jan 01, 2008 8:29 pm

Images will only work if you have a url address to the image. You can't upload a image.
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Postby mkaufman » Tue Jan 01, 2008 9:34 pm

Test:

[img]file:///C:/Documents%20and%20Settings/Michael/Desktop/Old%20Desktop/Weir%2012-31-76.jpg[/img]
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Postby mkaufman » Tue Jan 01, 2008 9:35 pm

ok - that didn't work.

Ideas?? Post them on Dozin??

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