This is the tone (for me at least)

This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby mijknahs » Fri Sep 13, 2013 5:29 pm



Check out the tone on the Peggy-O solos. Tone is so rich and chewey!
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby lunasparks » Fri Sep 13, 2013 7:11 pm

Yep, that's it for me too! This 12/31/1983 show and the month leading up to it sound to me like a point where something subtle happens in Jerry's tone where it does become "chewier" or rawer...but never harsh. I love it.

For me, if I had to pick a top "tone month", I'm going with April '84. Funny, too, because for years I just avoided 1984 altogether after hearing a few rough shows on tape many moons ago. But once I got on my tone quest, I kept being pulled back to this era. His tone was really just so sick around this time!

I've been digging the below site for streaming those crispy SBDs from late '83-'84. I expect others will enjoy this site:

https://listentothedead.com/
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby mkaufman » Sat Sep 14, 2013 6:49 am

Check out the close up of the middle pickup at 3:56. Is that a different pickup?

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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby lunasparks » Sat Sep 14, 2013 7:24 am

mkaufman wrote:Check out the close up of the middle pickup at 3:56. Is that a different pickup?

mk


I think it's just the old Super 2 before they changed the covers.
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby mijknahs » Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:59 am

I have those old pickups too. They sound the same as the new ones.
Oh, another reason I love this vid is the close ups.
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby Laytonco » Sat Sep 14, 2013 10:36 am

Can you please provide a link to this vid? Much appreciated. I'm having trouble finding it on my phone. Peace, Gil
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby waldo041 » Sat Sep 14, 2013 10:43 am

The only explanation for this tone can be that it is ALL in his fingers! At least that is what i have been told. And that if you woodshed enough, this gritty, chewy tone he is getting in this example will just become a part of your playing. Seriously, you will be able to do it on any instrument or rig you play, electric or acoustic.

People actually believe that!

~waldo
"Tone is in the instruments. Technique in the hands. Do what you will." ~ quote from some guy at the TGP forum
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby tcsned » Sat Sep 14, 2013 10:45 am

Here you go -

http://youtu.be/qnMxvi9WYIU

I think you're right Jim, I love that slightly driven but still crisp and articulate tone. That was the period I saw most of my shows too.
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby mijknahs » Sat Sep 14, 2013 10:50 am

I'm convinced that part of THAT TONE is the Tiger guitar itself. I bet if Doug Irwin made 10 identical Tiger guitars they would all sound a bit different and one might even be a "dud". One would probably stand out as the better one as well.
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby Laytonco » Sat Sep 14, 2013 11:08 am

Thank you for the link!
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby tcsned » Sat Sep 14, 2013 12:33 pm

mijknahs wrote:I'm convinced that part of THAT TONE is the Tiger guitar itself. I bet if Doug Irwin made 10 identical Tiger guitars they would all sound a bit different and one might even be a "dud". One would probably stand out as the better one as well.

I think we know which would stand out as the better one ;)
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby hippieguy1954 » Sun Sep 15, 2013 3:33 am

Don't forget, (and this has been discussed a lot before) they are playing at a very high volume.
I've done a lot of experimentation regarding volume.
At low volume, (low meaning bedroom level) you cannot get that tone without some minor sort of distortion or over drive effect and it will not be exactly the same. Just close.
At medium volume, (medium meaning your neighbors a block away will love it or hate you for it) you start to get it. Example: SMS Classic with Jerry mod (volume at 12 o'clock) into MC2100 (volume at 9 o'clock).
At very loud volume, (very loud meaning you can be heard 5 to 10 blocks away and people will be looking for the concert/party) it's right there. Example: SMS Classic with Jerry mod (volume on 1 or 2 o'clock) into Mc2100 (volume at 3 to 5 o'clock).
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby lunasparks » Sun Sep 15, 2013 5:15 am

hippieguy1954 wrote:Don't forget, (and this has been discussed a lot before) they are playing at a very high volume.


This is a good point, hippieguy. I think deep down we all know this, but it's easy to forget. The one caveat I'd add, though, is that it's not so much about volume as it is about pushing the Mac output transistors into clipping, however you get there. Now, these two things are obviously highly correlated. But a MC250 will clip earlier (and at lower volume) than a MC2100 and that before a MC2300. I have a modded 2105 and the truth is that I most feel like I'm getting close to THAT TONE only when I have in earplugs, record, and listen to the playback. When the needle is slamming hard to the right, transistors are cooking, JBL E120s are rocking back and forth, and the volume is loud enough to make me lose my equilibrium without earplugs...then it's just about there! :shock:

As you point out, it's close at "very loud" which is more what I use most of the time and I bet where a lot of people stop altogether, basically just short of sustained Mac transistor clipping. Waldo and Sarno (among others) have pointed out for years the significance of the Mac clipping element. It's all true, IME. Bottom-line: in my mind, you can't get to "it" without that clipping, though that's just a necessary and not sufficient condition. There are many other keys to the recipe as well.

Jim, you know all of this. Sorry if I'm de-railing your thread. Just freestyling :-)
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby waldo041 » Sun Sep 15, 2013 8:11 am

Are you guys sure that this particular aspect of his tone actually comes from his guitar and/or rig? I am repeatedly told over and over that the only way to get that is by practice. i am also repeatedly told that he could actually get that sound from anything he played! Clipping output transistors, modding preamps, and rewiring guitars could not even remotely be a possibility or a fraction of it, it is all in the fingers, right?

He must have been eating doritos or something crunchy before he played that peggy'o solo to get that grit. :lol:

~waldo
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Re: This is the tone (for me at least)

Postby lunasparks » Sun Sep 15, 2013 8:36 am

waldo041 wrote:Are you guys sure that this particular aspect of his tone actually comes from his guitar and/or rig? I am repeatedly told over and over that the only way to get that is by practice. i am also repeatedly told that he could actually get that sound from anything he played! Clipping output transistors, modding preamps, and rewiring guitars could not even remotely be a possibility or a fraction of it, it is all in the fingers, right?

He must have been eating doritos or something crunchy before he played that peggy'o solo to get that grit. :lol:

~waldo


Well, it does sound exactly like 1972 tone, so you may be onto something :lol:
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