Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby Chuckles » Fri Jun 14, 2013 4:15 am

As to the A/B blind "taste test"...

It's all fine and well to say people could tell the diff... but has anyone actually ever done it? Seems kinda lame to declare results before they are actually in....
Seems like I've been here before...

The Road's Facebook Page (including links to tunage) is here:
http://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Road/ ... 200?ref=nf
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby pedalpoet » Fri Jun 14, 2013 8:09 am

Finally made it through a bunch of y'alls links to video and sound clips in the first few pages of this thread. You are a talented group! Damn y'all rock! So glad I found this forum. I'm going to learn a lot and enjoy doing it. Big thanks to all of you.
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby mgbills » Fri Jun 14, 2013 8:15 am

You guys from PDX kill me! It's way too funny.

Three great Jerry players...same little town.

Although...I can't seem to catch a Tigerstrat gig to save my life.

Pete & Justin...did anyone record the GBB w/ Pete on pedal steel?

Peace
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby mijknahs » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:20 am

Here's an example of the most recent tone I'm getting with an old Fender Twin Reverb into a MC100 (Waldo mac mods), and 2xJBL E120. Fair recording too.

http://ia601800.us.archive.org/12/items ... .d1t01.mp3

The whole show if interested: http://archive.org/details/trr2013-06-0 ... 807.flac16
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby lunasparks » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:47 am

mijknahs wrote:Here's an example of the most recent tone I'm getting with an old Fender Twin Reverb into a MC100 (Waldo mac mods), and 2xJBL E120. Fair recording too.

http://ia601800.us.archive.org/12/items ... .d1t01.mp3

The whole show if interested: http://archive.org/details/trr2013-06-0 ... 807.flac16


I'm downloading the show now, can't wait to dig in! Below links to a very brief clip of my most recent tone. I've applied some EQ (see description in link)...feeling closer all the time :smile:

https://soundcloud.com/lunasparks/2013-06-15-gomorrah-eq
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby lunasparks » Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:13 am

Okay, folks. I'm back. First, apologies for playing the same stuff back & forth--trust me, it irritates me too--but I'm in the tone lab these days, squarely focused on dialing in some very specific Jerry tone!

Clip below is Jerry for first 20 seconds, then it's my rig. As always, I invite constructive criticism and thoughts on all things tone-related! Negative comments on playing will be met with deadly force. :-)

https://soundcloud.com/lunasparks/2013-06-30-terrapin


Whaddya think? Getting closer to nailing that tone?
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby mgbills » Wed Jul 03, 2013 12:30 pm

I'll take a shot...

You're tone is excellent, let's start with that. Also, it sounds to me like your pick dynamics are great too. Adamas?

To my limited ear...

1) At the beginning of your clip, you are just a touch warmer and smoother; perhaps just a hint of compression. Jerry's highs have a bit more bloom, a bit more sizzle, and perhaps a touch of grit. In my head...this could be a difference of anything. It's that small. A tube. A cap in the tone stack in either the amp or the guitar. Or just a pot difference in the guitar, as they affect tone as well. But minor.

2) Later in you're clip, you seem to have more of that character (bloom, sizzle, grit), than at the beginning. I'll listen again after I'm done blathering.

I do wish my brain had better defintion of mid-range. I'm sorry to say, I can't offer much in that range. It certainly did not sound over-based. I would say it's in the range.

Others may have better ears & descriptors.
Hope this is helpful.
Peace
M
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby lunasparks » Wed Jul 03, 2013 1:03 pm

mgbills wrote:Adamas?


You know it!

mgbills wrote:1) At the beginning of your clip, you are just a touch warmer and smoother; perhaps just a hint of compression. Jerry's highs have a bit more bloom, a bit more sizzle, and perhaps a touch of grit.


Thanks. No compression used, but there is some EQ. I've tried to do the tracks raw but Healy factors into this equation in a big way, so some of the work for me has been digging into EQs of the sbd recordings to see what I can see. Also, precisely part of the reason I've focused on this passage for my tests is that bloom, sizzle, and grit you identify. I think we can agree that this is part of the "it" that's so special. What I can say is that to get the tone in my clip my MC2105 is loud (driver card transistors very hot) and the E120 cones are trembling. The whole rig feels kind of on the verge of feedback. I do agree, though, there's at a minimum a little something missing on the high end bloom.

mgbills wrote:2) Later in you're clip, you seem to have more of that character (bloom, sizzle, grit), than at the beginning.


Funny, I almost felt the opposite...that the beginning was closer than later in the clip! But point taken. Very helpful comments, so much appreciated! Back to the lab.... :smile:
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby mgbills » Wed Jul 03, 2013 1:27 pm

Well...
I'm at least glad that we observed similar qualities. I usually try to shy away, as I know I've got some high end hearing issues. Shrill ex-wife :lol:

I'm rather tapped out after rig, unfortunately. I find the sound reinforcement stuff fascinating, but there are only so many hours in the day. Is there an actual gizmo out there for measuring a Hz spectrum? I'm thinking there must be. I've seen computer generated stuff in Audacity. I'd also love to play with that more, but again...time. Sound spectrum analyzer?

I'm really stretching on that. I've always thought it would be cool to build a room specifically for cranked amps. A couple of leads for your guitar in the outside wall. And then use some sort of monitor-type uncolored speakers to approximate what you're hearing. Record and analyze the whole business. I'm sure it's being done, but ...as stated ...its fascinating.
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby JustinJohn » Wed Jul 03, 2013 1:57 pm

Just a note about the "bloom" on the mid-to-high end notes...

I noticed that once I had my input jack modded to bypass the resistors, my pick attack became more dynamic, sustain became a bit easier to maintain, and the high end notes "bloomed" significantly more than previously and had that touch of grit in their resonance.

...just an observation.
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby James-T » Wed Jul 03, 2013 3:35 pm

Hey Justin

Can you elaborate on that mod. I'm still struggling with notes above the 12th fret high e string on my solos like in china cat where I want the notes to really bloom. They do acoustically but even with the axe fx it's challenging. The closest I've gotten is with my 83 Strat and not with a dual sound and that was through a blues deluxe, where I was happy with getting as you say a bloomy note up high.

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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby boater1941 » Fri Jul 05, 2013 11:36 pm

Hello all my first post in this awesome forum. The beautiful crystal clear and my fav tone was 82 when they 1st recorded in digital(1st band ever when people thought digital watches were amazing. 85 in my opinion was the greatest sparkle tiger year. It started to get still beautiful but slight diff when he got midi addicted. 1st appeared on black/white strat in space the was clamped on wolf 87 ish. I built my own pre using twin ab768 circuit rebuild kit from flea bay modding power sector dead using vibrato mercury power supply and one key factor is NOS fat boy tubes either GE or RCA(not these cheap JJ's amd what I've seen on market. Did all known mods even the misterious unleaked mid pot sweep type resistance and cap in which I milked off well known jer's right hand man in gear modding who's not afraid to talk via instagram. MrHealy has some cool tricks since being recently popped up on fleabay. I mounted the tone controls horizontally using tube clamps and down right side vertical is real fender spring tank. All enclosed in wood frame with intake fans on left side and exhaust on top behind tubes. 1ststep. Next Mc2300 or lower wattage same specs Mc model eg 2100. Not banana jack mods,internal mods especially the sound card mods .....kill the retarded sentry guard then bigger filter caps in the 40g range. Waldo's buff. is as close as you can get and pre set at 6db's I believe unless you build your own with no gain knob(use hardset screwdriver pot or calculate db equation and use solid film resitor. No variation needed at least keep between 6to9db's. make all wires as short as possible to your 5way and solder the buffer/tone wire as close as possible to your pup selector switch. Dimarz...dp104's buckers split, and if wanted neck sd-1 single coil(split buckers rule). 3rd JBL's E's if you have the power to open em up or K-120 crystal n clean and no caffeine at lower amperages. If you cant open up a single E or set of two or more to atleast 75% the wire up some K's..no recones either. There lots of fresh ones out there still in sealed boxes. Still have two factory boxed that pull in almost 7ohms when tested.
That's it patience is key took me over 5 years to get THE TONE. Now I've moved on to piezo bridge,parallel/split push pull pots and an out board analog to digi floor midi unit which is just unreal. It all starts with the amazing high draw/volume/filtered clean to and that flute sliding down the neck gives me chills like the 90's eyes.
PEACE n Cool site.
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby mkaufman » Sat Jul 06, 2013 5:34 am

Any sound samples?

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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby waldo041 » Sat Jul 06, 2013 8:50 am

boater1941 wrote: Did all known mods even the misterious unleaked mid pot sweep type resistance and cap in which I milked off well known jer's right hand man in gear modding who's not afraid to talk via instagram.


Can you show us what exactly Healy stated to you about this?


~waldo
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby Pete B. » Sat Jul 06, 2013 12:02 pm

lunasparks wrote:Okay, folks. I'm back. First, apologies for playing the same stuff back & forth--trust me, it irritates me too--but I'm in the tone lab these days, squarely focused on dialing in some very specific Jerry tone!

Clip below is Jerry for first 20 seconds, then it's my rig. As always, I invite constructive criticism and thoughts on all things tone-related! Negative comments on playing will be met with deadly force. :-)

https://soundcloud.com/lunasparks/2013-06-30-terrapin


Whaddya think? Getting closer to nailing that tone?


Based on that clip comparison I'd say your misisng the high end sparkle. Maybe turn up the treble more.

waldo041 wrote:
boater1941 wrote: Did all known mods even the misterious unleaked mid pot sweep type resistance and cap in which I milked off well known jer's right hand man in gear modding who's not afraid to talk via instagram.


Can you show us what exactly Healy stated to you about this?


~waldo


Sheesh... I thought everybody had the mid-sweep mod by now. :wink:
fwiw, It's standard issue on Pedal Steel amps.
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