Roctron Velocity 300 power amp

Re: Roctron Velocity 300 power amp

Postby gpilcher2001 » Fri Jan 18, 2013 5:13 pm

As far as the jerry dirty clean tone, can you get the amp to musically clip at decent decible levels? My 40 watt tube amp is to load for most venues. Greg...
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Re: Roctron Velocity 300 power amp

Postby zoooombiex » Fri Jan 18, 2013 9:46 pm

gpilcher2001 wrote:As far as the jerry dirty clean tone, can you get the amp to musically clip at decent decible levels? My 40 watt tube amp is to load for most venues. Greg...


If you're asking about the Rocktron, you don't want that for clipping at low volume levels. You'd need a smaller tube amp or to get your overdrive from pedals.
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Re: Roctron Velocity 300 power amp

Postby Jon S. » Sat Jan 19, 2013 6:27 am

My short response is "what zooombiex said" but here's a bit more.

By clipping, I think you mean overdriving the output section by running it hot but this is a good opportunity to contrast that with something else that many people call clipping (I'm not sure that's accurate but in any event ...) which is to slam the front end of your power section with an extra hot input signal. I.e., the old "power amp overdrive" versus "slammin' it in the red" (the olden term for when you pushed a console with a too-hot signal and the input signal gauges would move past the green part of the spectrum into the red "warning, you're overdriving the console's input section" portion).

Both can sound good or bad depending on the gear and the context. As just one quick example, the acoustic guitars on Obladi-Oblada were recorded by slamming the console into the red. Normally, with acoustics, that sounds awful. The Beatles, Martin, and their recording personnel made it sound wonderful - an effect unto itself, if you will.

With tube amps, more often than not, both types of distortion can sound awesome. Whether it's slamming your tube amp with a SS Tubescreamer pedal or cranking your blackface Fender amp to 10 (as Hendrix did on some of his recorded solos many people still think were recorded with Marshalls), it can sound great.

With the RV300, it's really easy - too much so, perhaps, to "slam it into the red" with a hot input. IMO (YMMV), the distortion you get by doing that to an RV300 is not especially pleasing. That's why it's so important, I believe, to drive yours with a quality preamp that includes a rear signal trim pot in addition to a front panel volume or gain control (it may be labelled either way). The good units, like SMSs and FYDs (I now own one of each), come with rear trim pots. On my SMS, for example, I run my rear trim pot around 1PM. That allows me to feed the RV300 an input signal it can handle cleanly.

The beauty of McI overdrive, I've read here and elsewhere, resides in the magic that occurs when they're run loud enough to produce output stage overdrive. With my RV300, to be honest, even when I've gigged outdoors before a couple of hundred people unmiced, I've never had to turn it up above slightly over half way up. I.e., it's damn loud! So I can't help you with a description of what the RV300 sounds like clipping in that fashion. I can tell you that, for most users, it won't be a practical way to generate overdrive and you'll be better off in my view using an effect pedal for that. Though now that I think of it, I've never personally tried an RV100 - maybe that would be a better option for this (worth making another point now - we often buy more amp than we need or can use ... then we wonder why, with the amp's volume at 3, it just doesn't sound that good ...).

Just my 2 cents. I'm not an engineer or tech though there are plenty who are who post here - perhaps some will also chime in.
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Re: Roctron Velocity 300 power amp

Postby gpilcher2001 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:58 am

That answer although long, is a good one. And was what I wanted to know. Thank you. I'm one of those guys looking for that output distorion. Or should I say I'm stuggling to find a useable balance between loud enough cleans for the super clean thing and that clean/dirt jerry thing. Maybe I'm just to picky but I cant get it out of any pedals I've tried. On stage a 20 watt tube amp can do this because of the support of the monitor, but at an un mic'd practice 20 watts won't cut it and 40 watts is to much. This is why I'm intrested In a solid state power section and the curiosity about wattage and clipping in ss amps. Maybe one of these days I can try one with an overdrive to see if the pedal idea works better with a clean ss amp. Imop overdrives dont show their magic on a tube amp until the tubes are cooking a little Greg...
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Re: Roctron Velocity 300 power amp

Postby zoooombiex » Sat Jan 19, 2013 10:12 am

gpilcher2001 wrote:That answer although long, is a good one. And was what I wanted to know. Thank you. I'm one of those guys looking for that output distorion. Or should I say I'm stuggling to find a useable balance between loud enough cleans for the super clean thing and that clean/dirt jerry thing. Maybe I'm just to picky but I cant get it out of any pedals I've tried. On stage a 20 watt tube amp can do this because of the support of the monitor, but at an un mic'd practice 20 watts won't cut it and 40 watts is to much. This is why I'm intrested In a solid state power section and the curiosity about wattage and clipping in ss amps. Maybe one of these days I can try one with an overdrive to see if the pedal idea works better with a clean ss amp. Imop overdrives dont show their magic on a tube amp until the tubes are cooking a little Greg...


Have you tried using different cabs to satisfy your differing volume needs. more efficient speakers can make a significant difference in volume. and a bigger cab with more speakers will give you a bigger, louder, and cleaner sound. also, depending on the amp, you can use an impedance mismatch with the cab to raise or lower the amp's efficiency (mismatch of 1 order will generally bring down the volume and alter the tonal balance). Kimock frequently notes this (fender type amps can generally tolerate a mismatch in either direction very safely).

So in theory you could use something like a 30-40 watt amp that, with a 2x12 with efficient speakers for your loudest shows or practices, then pull out a little 1x12 cab with an inefficient speaker for smaller, quieter shows.
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Re: Roctron Velocity 300 power amp

Postby mgbills » Sat Jan 19, 2013 12:27 pm

gpilcher ~
I know it's an over-covered topic...but I sincerely love my Earth Drive to add just a touch of Jerry-Dirt. To my ear, it adds that bit of sizzle/clip that tubes do when they're crankin'.

This is not a paid advertisement, and I admit my ears are 49 years old and have loved 126 Dead Shows, etc
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Re: Roctron Velocity 300 power amp

Postby gpilcher2001 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 9:50 pm

Zooombiex- I havent tried the impeadence missmatch but have gone between a 2x12 and a 1x12. I've settled on the 1x12. I do use k120's. They are efficient speakers. I like the vintage 30's a little quieter than the jbl but only like it in an hrdx. To honky for some reason with my weber amp. As you can tried a bunch of stuff. Ill try running at 4 ohms and see if I like the sound.

Mgbills- I'm using an earth drive but i cant get it to drive smoothly on my rig and I dont like running other effects through it. I'm missing something . It just doesnt sound that good to me running gain last in my chain. I think the earth drive sounds its best running into a fairly hot amp. I think i'm getting close though. Its been a while since I've gigged. New band, itll be a couple months before we have enough material to gig. Cant wait to run this rig through a sound system.

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Re: Roctron Velocity 300 power amp

Postby zoooombiex » Mon Jan 21, 2013 7:17 pm

FWIW, here's a little clip of my v300, just noodling around.

it's the guitar (335 copy) > Sarno SGBB > BJF SBEQ (turned on halfway through) > V300 > HT cab, mic'd an ASW Elegante

No preamp. Reactance @ 10, Definition @ 3:00

https://soundcloud.com/haassauce-1/v300-a-major-noodle
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Re: Roctron Velocity 300 power amp

Postby gpilcher2001 » Mon Jan 21, 2013 9:53 pm

Sounds good! I like the noodle. Thanks for the clip. Greg...
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Re: Roctron Velocity 300 power amp

Postby Smolder » Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:11 pm

Jon - as a point of reference... your sms settings are exactly how I set mine into the mc50 at just under half volume... with slightly less reverb. This is just for loud practice, as I don't have the opportunity to gig the sms/mac/d120 rig in a band right now.
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Re: Roctron Velocity 300 power amp

Postby Jon S. » Tue Jan 22, 2013 4:14 am

Smolder wrote:Jon - as a point of reference... your sms settings are exactly how I set mine into the mc50 at just under half volume... with slightly less reverb. This is just for loud practice, as I don't have the opportunity to gig the sms/mac/d120 rig in a band right now.

I'm not surprised at all - I'm tempted to say "great minds think alike" but the truth may be closer to we have the same reference point so why not?!
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