OBEL problem

Re: OBEL problem

Postby hippieguy1954 » Mon Oct 21, 2013 1:58 pm

I was wondering about where the wires are coming from to your output jacks too. You show a great close up of the soldering connections, but I can't see exactly where the wires are coming from. Looks like the two white ones are from the OBEL switch, but can't tell where the black ones are coming from.
I know how frustrating this can be. You might want to review this. It makes it all very clear. It's time consuming, but not complicated. Thanks to Waldo, we have it to refer to whenever!
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Re: OBEL problem

Postby TI4-1009 » Mon Oct 21, 2013 2:18 pm

There aren't too many things that can go wrong with "taking it out and puting it back in"- but this is one of them. Quick test would be to just swap the cables at the two jacks- guitar ends only (but by this point I'm guessing you already tried that?).
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Re: OBEL problem

Postby hippieguy1954 » Mon Oct 21, 2013 3:34 pm

TI4-1009 wrote:There aren't too many things that can go wrong with "taking it out and puting it back in"- but this is one of them. Quick test would be to just swap the cables at the two jacks- guitar ends only (but by this point I'm guessing you already tried that?).


I sure hope he has!
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Re: OBEL problem

Postby gr8fl4295 » Tue Oct 22, 2013 7:56 am

I switched the jacks after the first full view photo so I could remember which cable went where.

Here's my description of the wires, which I believe line up with waldo's digram....

OBEL switch:
top left connection: white wire to mono jack
top right connection: white wire to mono jack
middle left connection: white wire to volume pot
middle right connection: yellow wire to TPC1
bottom left connection: bridged to bottom right connection
bottom right connection: bridged to bottom left connection

Mono jack:
white wire to OBEL switch
white wire to OBEL switch
black wire to ground

Stereo jack:
white wire to volume pot
black wire to ground
black wire to 9v battery

Here's an updated full view of the rear cavity:
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Re: OBEL problem

Postby TI4-1009 » Tue Oct 22, 2013 9:34 am

The OBEL jack isn't mono- it has to be stereo- TRS. One for ground, one sending signal to the effects loop box, and the third returning the signal from the box back to the guitar.

It looks like the wiring as you describe is correct- as long as the right wires go to the right tabs on the jacks. When you removed and replaced the controls you didn't desolder or remove any of the wire connections- right?

EDIT: Looking closer at your new photo- Hard to see, but it looks like both black wires from the right side (out to amp) jack go to the ground ring?? The thicker black wire from the battery disappears under the tone pot so you can't see where it goes clearly, you just have to guess from the thickness and the angles. If the black wire from the battery does go to the output jack it must make like a 90 degree bend under that pot? Can you confirm?

2nd EDIT: Maybe a black to black splice under the pot? I see the reds are spliced too.

3rd EDIT: If you absolutely didn't disconnect any wires from the jacks (or anywhere else) when you did the R&R then the jacks are a red herring. If they were right before they should still be right.
Last edited by TI4-1009 on Tue Oct 22, 2013 1:34 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: OBEL problem

Postby hippieguy1954 » Tue Oct 22, 2013 11:23 am

Mono jack:
white wire to OBEL switch
white wire to OBEL switch
black wire to ground

Stereo jack:
white wire to volume pot
black wire to ground
black wire to 9v battery


This seems reversed to me. You might have just made a typo. I don't know. The stereo jack is for the OBEL send and return. The other jack is also a stereo jack that you plug the mono guitar cord into, so you have the extra tab for the battery ground to turn the buffer off when the guitar is unplugged.
It should be just the opposite of what you state above.
Like this:
Stereo jack for stereo chord to junction box:
white wire to OBEL switch
white wire to OBEL switch
black wire to ground

Stereo jack for mono cord to amp:
white wire to volume pot
black wire to sleeve
black wire to 9v battery to ring
And yea, you can't really see any of that clearly in the pics.

Hope this helps.
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Re: OBEL problem

Postby gr8fl4295 » Tue Oct 22, 2013 6:05 pm

Let me try to answer some of the questions and concerns...

I guess I did mean stereo jack. I only thought it was a mono jack because a mono cable plugs into it.

I didn't desolder or remove any of the wire connections. What I had to do is cut the wires to the pickups to remove them from the body. I had those spliced and heat shrink wrapped, and they appear to work fine.

This is how I have the jacks...

Looking at the photo, we can say jack on the left, and jack on the right. the jack on the left is connected to the OBEL switch, and I plug a stereo cable into, then goes into stereo jack of the jbox.
the jack on the right uses the mono cable into the mono jack on the jbox.
The jack on the left has 2 white wires connected to the OBEL switch and 1 black wire connected to the ground circle.
The jack on the right has 2 black wires, one going to the battery and one going to the ground circle. It also has 1 white wire connected to the volume pot.
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Re: OBEL problem

Postby TI4-1009 » Wed Oct 23, 2013 5:45 am

OK, I fold.

Last resort might be to plug in the guitar and use a multimeter to go from connection to connection along the signal path and check voltage. Hold the black probe on a good ground and touch the red probe to the connections. Normal signal should only be a few volts. At some point you should lose it. Who knows, it could be a broken wire or a cold solder joint? Good luck!
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Re: OBEL problem

Postby hippieguy1954 » Wed Oct 23, 2013 5:49 am

Ok, then it seems your out put jacks on the guitar are wired correctly and so is the OBEL switch.

Check these to make sure they are working correctly:
OBEL switch (I know you said you replaced it, but maybe you over heated it? I don't know.)
Cables
Junction box
Also, make sure you are plugging the stereo chord into the out put jack on the guitar that has the two white wires and ground.

Like Waldo said, It's very difficult to do this without having the guitar in hand. I would go through the guitar, cables and jbox with a continuity tester. One that makes a sound when you have continuity so you know for sure there is continuity everywhere it should be. That is what needs to be done, if all else fails.
Anyway, have you tried anything else? Let us know.
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Re: OBEL problem

Postby gr8fl4295 » Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:21 am

So what you're saying is, I probably need to send the guitar to one of you guys to get this taken care of. ??
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Re: OBEL problem

Postby ccw3432 » Wed Oct 23, 2013 9:01 am

I just looked at your video and have a question. The guitar seemed to work when you had the cord plugged into the guitar out jack and when you had the switch in the up position (non-OBEL setting) and not work when in the down position (OBEL setting). Looking at the video and your photo of how your switch is wired, it seems to me it's your OBEL side that is not working. Is this accurate or am I missing something?
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Re: OBEL problem

Postby hippieguy1954 » Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:05 am

gr8fl4295 wrote:So what you're saying is, I probably need to send the guitar to one of you guys to get this taken care of. ??


If you can't do it, any good guitar tech can follow the Tiger wiring diagram above. Like I said before and I think you can see, it's not complicated. Just a little time consuming.
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Re: OBEL problem

Postby TI4-1009 » Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:31 am

"Do not write so that you can be understood, write so that you cannot be misunderstood." -Epictetus

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Re: OBEL problem

Postby TI4-1009 » Wed Oct 23, 2013 12:37 pm

gr8fl4295 wrote:So what you're saying is, I probably need to send the guitar to one of you guys to get this taken care of. ??


Leo (Scarlet Fire guitars) is in Dallas, 3 hours up the road. I bet he'd have it sorted out in 20 minutes.
"Do not write so that you can be understood, write so that you cannot be misunderstood." -Epictetus

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Re: OBEL problem

Postby ccw3432 » Wed Oct 23, 2013 7:23 pm

I wouldn't give up on this yet. See my post above. If I was correct there, your problem is isolated to a very small segment between the switch and the OBEL jack (assuming your TRS cord, junction box, and everything post OBEL jack is functioning) . It could be as simple as your OBEL jack grounding out on the shielding paint you put in. Pull the jack, double check the wiring and plug the guitar into it while it is removed from the guitar body. See if you get sound.
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