Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby Jon S. » Tue Sep 02, 2014 9:58 am

If you can't "do Jerry" with a Strat, Twin Reverb, and multi-effects unit, Brother, it ain't the gear. This being said, I love my new and prior Dead-ish axes and both of my preamp/amp/cab rigs, I feel inspired playing through them.
"For me, I think the only danger is being too much in love with guitar playing. The music is the most important thing, and the guitar is only the instrument." Jerry Garcia
User avatar
Jon S.
Senior Member
 
Posts: 1477
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:34 pm

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby mgbills » Tue Sep 02, 2014 12:34 pm

Is Jerry a guitar god? The answer is totally subjective. tatittle ...I'm in complete agreement.

Here is my view, and not just because I drank the Koolaid.

1) Licks that survive the test of time. Check.
2) Mastery of the instrument. Check.
3) Public acceptance. Yup.
4) ...and maybe the ability to improvise with purpose. Definately

Here is where he diverges for me.

I think about EC. Slow Hand of God. Is the guy great. Yup. And he certainly meets the above criteria. But...to me EC has been ringing pentatonics for too many years. He gave up risk taking with Cream. By his own recent admission, he doesn't like jamming. So does he really ascend to #4. Compare this with Jerry. Jerry came out and played live for 30 years. He delivered those signature licks, and then took them somewhere new. He took risks. Every night. Sometimes it was drab. Sometimes it was magic, but he took the risks. And it cost him.

I've heard tell in recent history that if you never saw Led Zeppelin live, you missed the boat. Apparently their ability to improvise was legendary. But I missed the boat. Jimmy Page is a legend.

On & on. Hendrix comes to mind. David Gilmour. I'm being completely honest when I saw I loved it all. But it's dead ... if it's not alive.

On this issue I have to admit I'm jaded. I've seen almost every band I ever wanted to see. Exceptions would be Jimi, Led Zep & The Beatles. And frankly ...I don't care if I ever see another canned show where some supposed God delivers a solo "Just like the Album." I almost feel like having to play a show with a canned set list keeps some of the greats out of live performance.

And I guess this get's to the core of why and where I put Jerry. His music evolved for his entire career, and luckily we can all still listen.
Peace
M
"Hi Ho...the Carrion Crow...FoldeRoldeRiddle"
User avatar
mgbills
Senior Member
 
Posts: 832
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:04 pm
Location: The Northwest Corner

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby mgbills » Tue Sep 02, 2014 2:41 pm

And...Jeff Matson is tearing it up. Between his evolution and the addition of Skip, they're as good as I've ever seen them.

Now...why are the skipping the PNW. :-x
"Hi Ho...the Carrion Crow...FoldeRoldeRiddle"
User avatar
mgbills
Senior Member
 
Posts: 832
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2010 12:04 pm
Location: The Northwest Corner

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby tatittle » Tue Sep 02, 2014 4:12 pm

I agree with you of course mg. I was more taking issue with the musician wording vs. guitarist and the whole calling a man divine brings out the contrarian in me. Some of the things I perceive Garcia lacking at times may just be the equiptment he used too actually...some things just aren't possible with a clean Fender rig with JBL's.
I think the fact that Garcia was part of a great band for so long played a large role in his becoming so great too. Lots of other guys didn't enjoy that. This may be largely related to Garcia's personality and approach to life...or society/money etc., things I may share with him which in turn lead me to like him more than others on a mere musical level.
I was never head over heels for any of the guys you mentioned, possible exception of Hendrix. I was thinking more of horn players and other instruments..pianists etc, and guys totally different like Micheal Hedges etc. But for me Garcia had the most assets and was good at the things I like best over time for sure.
tatittle
Magic Hand
Magic Hand
 
Posts: 487
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2012 8:44 am
Location: NJ via Bklyn; Detroit; Charleston; Boulder; Miami; D.C.; etc

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby James-T » Tue Sep 02, 2014 6:16 pm

I saw Michael Hedges in Eugene in the fall of 84 at the Hult Centre. He opened for Garcia. In fact I saw three Garcia shows on that NW tour, the Hult, The Starry Night in Portland (night 2) and at the Capitol Theatre in Seattle. Hedges blew Garcia out of the water that night - sorry to say. In fact Garcia was so hit and miss. The Hult Center was a sterile show, zero energy, but the Starry Night was perhaps the best Garcia I've ever seen - his playing was off the charts - a 20 min Don't let Go, and if someone has a recording of that I'd love to hear it!. Perhaps 100 folks there in a 250+ capacity club. No stage. Garcia just played on the dance floor and it was largely open, like not that many folks there, and then in Seattle he was totally off again. What's a God to someone is a mere mortal to someone else. I don't really believe in guitar Gods, but really Hendrix was like no other on the electric guitar in and out of the studio. He was simply fresh and ground breaking. Garcia on Live Dead - the same, and they say that was Garcia's favourite Dark Star. Clapton is a great bluesman and song writer and interpreter, Gilmore is just so tasteful and creative and a tone monster. Its all good.

And DSO really rocks. :smile: Big deal if Jeff's tone is not exactly Garcia's anyways, and like - well Garcia had so many different tones, some killer and well, some just not that great - so really what is JM supposed to imitate. The guys a great player and doesn't need a 10K replica guitar to play in the biggest Dead Cover band going - now that's pretty cool. :smile:

Peace,

James
James-T
Skeleton
Skeleton
 
Posts: 343
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:57 pm

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby hippieguy1954 » Wed Sep 03, 2014 6:50 am

A stock strat and a Twin (or any ab763 circuit amp). All of the stuff we chase are hybrids/refinements of that basic setup. :smile:
Jim

First show: 1973
Last show: 1994
User avatar
hippieguy1954
Senior Member
 
Posts: 1318
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:29 pm
Location: Upstate, NY

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby James-T » Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:30 am

A stock strat and a Twin (or any ab763 circuit amp). All of the stuff we chase are hybrids/refinements of that basic setup.


+1 for that. I had to unload my 73 SF twin because it was just to loud a clean for the gigs I do, but the 73 SF Vibrolux I picked up is perfect. I play more often than not at a gig with a stock Strat. I think in my case its all about the amp, and decent pups, meaning single coils or a spilt humbucker. Well said above - the rest is just variations on a theme. :smile:

Peace,

James
James-T
Skeleton
Skeleton
 
Posts: 343
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:57 pm

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby bpg21 » Fri Oct 03, 2014 11:37 am

Not sure if this link will work but here I am playing an Old Westbury (cheap Japanese Les Paul style with Dimarzios) straight into a Fender G-Dec 15 watt. I am playing along with a JamMan loop of a 68 recording of The Eleven for all you late 60's fan. Not quite his late 60's tone. I'm thinking about getting some P-90s . i recorded this with my Iphone so not too Hi Fi.
https://soundcloud.com/ice9ner/the-11-sample
bpg21
Donna
Donna
 
Posts: 55
Joined: Tue Nov 10, 2009 3:07 pm

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby aiq » Sat Oct 04, 2014 8:58 am

By all reports JG hated the deification. The RS tribute issue has are refence to him being an "avatar". No.

A great player who stood in the crossroads of change and stayed true to the game. Absolutely.

I did see LZ in '69 they really didn't jam that first tour. More like a couple choruses of good blues soloing. Lost interest in them after the second record.
User avatar
aiq
Steal Your Face
Steal Your Face
 
Posts: 207
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2009 6:52 am
Location: Gulf Coast.

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby gratefulredhead » Wed Oct 15, 2014 12:07 pm

This is such a fun and informative thread! I'd like to contribute with a sample of my rig. I use a slightly modified 65 Reissue Twin. (I turned it into a half-power amp by removing the two center power tubes and disconnecting one speaker, also bypassed the "normal" channel to route all signal into my Vibrato channel pre-amp. Replaced some key caps with the orange caps. I use a 1978 Ibanez MC200 that I've put a Dimarzio Tone Zone and Air Norton in, made them splittable, and installed an Alembic Strato Blaster. I use a CAE wah pedal (LOVE it), an Electro Harmonix Tube Zipper (envelope), an EH stereo tube pre-amp as my distortion pedal, and a Boss Octave divider.

On the video I have linked to I am bypassing all effects however. This is just the guitar and the amp. I think it sounds pretty close to Garcia's 73-74 clean tone. Maybe a touch too clean, but I like the sound. I set the amps eq to the following. Treble- 7.5, Mid- 9.5, Bass- 4-5 (depending on the room).

Let me know what you think!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C2OhRHH ... OQ&index=1
gratefulredhead
tiger
tiger
 
Posts: 21
Joined: Tue May 07, 2013 8:20 am

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby SpaceYrface43 » Wed Oct 15, 2014 12:18 pm

Put a JBL in the twin you will be one step closer. Simple move but you will hear the difference.
SpaceYrface43
710 ashbury
710 ashbury
 
Posts: 265
Joined: Sat Apr 01, 2006 2:40 pm
Location: Orchard Park,New York

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby gratefulredhead » Wed Oct 15, 2014 12:28 pm

Great tip, Space! Thanks. The stock Jensens don't have a clear low end, which is why I dial off my bass settings. Otherwise my lows end up muddy, but it leaves my tone a touch thin. Do you recommend a particular JBL model?
gratefulredhead
tiger
tiger
 
Posts: 21
Joined: Tue May 07, 2013 8:20 am

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby James-T » Wed Oct 15, 2014 6:46 pm

Sweet playing Gratefulredhead and killer vocals. The whole band is smoking hot. Made my day hearing that clip. Like the tele to. :smile:

Peace,

James
James-T
Skeleton
Skeleton
 
Posts: 343
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:57 pm

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby hippieguy1954 » Thu Oct 16, 2014 3:32 am

You guys sound great! Nice playing and nice keys :smile:

With the Twin at half power, I'd suggest JBL D120's or K120's depending on how much breakup you want.
K's handle 100 watts and D's handle 40 or 50 watts I believe.
Jim

First show: 1973
Last show: 1994
User avatar
hippieguy1954
Senior Member
 
Posts: 1318
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:29 pm
Location: Upstate, NY

Re: Jerry Tone: is it the guitar or amp that matters?

Postby gratefulredhead » Thu Oct 16, 2014 2:05 pm

Thanks for the very kind remarks and the helpful ideas guys! I'm going to have to exercise a lot of self restraint to not spend my afternoons tooling around these boards. Many good folks on here, and a ton of great information!
gratefulredhead
tiger
tiger
 
Posts: 21
Joined: Tue May 07, 2013 8:20 am

PreviousNext

Return to Jerry Tone

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests