Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby lunasparks » Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:24 pm

lunasparks wrote:Just thought I'd make the below available for interested parties. I went through the 1983 Club Front Help-->Slip rehearsal and edited together clips of Jerry's tone, trying to focus on the parts where he's coming through very clearly and mostly alone. Such a focused, present and taut tone! :shock: Anyway, I'm planning to use this clip to help me have a good, recorded reference tone (a la the Touch clip Vic made available a while back). I enabled downloading so you should be able to save it for yourself.

https://soundcloud.com/lunasparks/2013-03-21-1983-club-front

Enjoy!



And here's Jerry's isolated TOG solo (originally from Vic), also downloadable:

https://soundcloud.com/lunasparks/jg-touch-solo-isolated-track

Enjoy...again!
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby lunasparks » Sat Apr 06, 2013 7:19 pm

For those also on the endless tone quest, the link below is today's gift. I made a little FOTM loop from my favorite 4/20/1984 show. I had great fun jamming along today. Below that is an example of what I was up to all afternoon. Not the 1984 tone (Boogie is too nasally), but the Mkiia does seem to like my Qtron+:

FOTM jam loop:
https://soundcloud.com/lunasparks/2013-04-06-fire-jamtrack-1984

My example of the fun:
https://soundcloud.com/lunasparks/2013-04-06-fire-jam-edit-1984
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby tcsned » Sun Apr 07, 2013 9:37 am

Nice playing and great tone! You've got a great set up. Thanks!
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby tcsned » Sun Apr 07, 2013 9:42 am

I was at those Spectrum shows :D missed a biology test due to wretched excess :oops:

It would be cool for others to take that cool loop you made and post their own takes. What recording software are you using?
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby lunasparks » Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:09 am

tcsned wrote:I was at those Spectrum shows :D missed a biology test due to wretched excess :oops:

It would be cool for others to take that cool loop you made and post their own takes. What recording software are you using?


Thanks for the kind words. And, yes, to be clear I've enabled downloading on that link so that everyone should be able to keep an mp3 of the loop for themselves. I like to use these loops for my tone experiments so that I can get close to hearing what my rig sounds like in the context of a pretty solid band (!!!). For me, the recorded tone is really the only way I can even begin to zero in on what I'm after. I'd love to hear others' tones as part of the same idea.

My setup is pretty straightforward. Sennheiser MD421 mic --> Mackie Onyx Blackjack USB preamp --> computer --> Audacity.

Priciest part of the equation was the MD421. Based on my experience thus far I'd recommend the Mackie Blackjack preamp to run into the computer. It lists for $150 but can be had on eBay for half that...these have bad reviews all over the net because they had driver problems upon release. But the hardware is very, very good for this price point; they just screwed themselves with drivers--and even though they solved those problems in 2012, the bad reviews stay for life and seem to keep people away. For the $75 (shipped) I paid for it on eBay, it's hard for me to imagine doing better...and downloading the new, updated drivers made the whole thing work like a charm--it was a steal!

Audacity is a free program and seems to work just fine for my purposes; just had to get up the learning curve. Anyone with a halfway decent computer and mic could be recording clips, doing tone tests, etc. and posting them on Soundcloud (also free hosting) for an all-in cost less than $100. Why not? Let's hear somebody really NAIL THE TONE!!
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby lunasparks » Sun Apr 21, 2013 4:54 pm

Another GD loop/jamtrack available for those who want to download down below...this one is a couple of bars of the Terrapin jam.

Also below are the results of my most recent tone test, both the isolated track as well as mixed with the jamtrack. Still not nailing those thick, shimmering highs that Jerry bathed in ... but I feel like I'm getting closer all the time!

Terrapin loop/jamtrack:
https://soundcloud.com/lunasparks/2013-04-21-terrapin-loop-1984

Isolated solo/noodling/tone test:
https://soundcloud.com/lunasparks/2013-04-21-terrapin-test-2

Jamtrack/noodling mixdown:
https://soundcloud.com/lunasparks/2013-04-21-terrapin-test-2-1
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby mijknahs » Thu Apr 25, 2013 11:30 pm

I'm getting closer...
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby lunasparks » Fri Apr 26, 2013 3:41 am

mijknahs wrote:I'm getting closer...


Ha, I'm sure that's true! I'd love to hear some good, home recorded (or if a show, mic'd sbd) of your rig. Any floating around? I feel like I can't get a good feel listening to camcorder/phone mics, way too much nuance and complexity lost, IMO. But from what I've heard thus far, you've got some good Jerry tone mojo going on!
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby cmc64 » Fri Apr 26, 2013 9:20 am

lunasparks:

I have a Mesa MK IIA head which will be headed out to Shakedown in the very near future. I like what I have been hearing from yours and between the post on April 7 and the post on April 21 it sounds like you are really starting to get the amp dialed in. There is a noticeable increase in tonal quality between the two posts. Good work and keep it up!!
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby lunasparks » Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:29 am

cmc64 wrote:lunasparks:

I have a Mesa MK IIA head which will be headed out to Shakedown in the very near future. I like what I have been hearing from yours and between the post on April 7 and the post on April 21 it sounds like you are really starting to get the amp dialed in. There is a noticeable increase in tonal quality between the two posts. Good work and keep it up!!


Glad you're liking what you hear. Between the two post dates you note, the amp had some additional tweaks done by Joe. I agree it's improved (again!). What I'm struggling with now is that while the Boogie sounds great, I don't think it will nail the 80s Jerry Twin thing quite right. The voicing is too different, most noticeably in the upper register where the Boogie seems compressed/congested vs. Jerry's tone.

The Jerry tone I'm chasing has that crisp attack followed by a complex, open "bloom" that's not really as clean & round as it is splintered/phasey/dirty. Words can't do it justice...for me I just have to listen to some of those April 1984 soundboards where Jerry is pretty high in the mix, 4/19 and 4/20 especially ... listen to 4/19 Terrapin segue starting 4:50 or so for what I'm talking about. His notes just spit and smack and shimmer so beautifully:

http://archive.org/details/gd1984-04-19.sbd.miller.118658.flac16

For what it's worth, the closer I listen the more I'm convinced that there are some really crucial things missing from known Jerry mods as well--which shouldn't be surprising given that the guts of his Twins have not actually been seen by anyone here (at least as I understand it). Thus the title of this thread :-) I understand the arguments along the lines of it's in the hands, it's in the clipped power amp, it's in the loudness (stressed JBLs), etc. All true to some degree, sure--and I've tried some of it, just ask my neighbors :shock: But there's some secret sauce in the preamp that eludes us ... and I can't give up my obsession!
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby waldo041 » Sun Apr 28, 2013 7:15 am

lunasparks wrote:For what it's worth, the closer I listen the more I'm convinced that there are some really crucial things missing from known Jerry mods as well--which shouldn't be surprising given that the guts of his Twins have not actually been seen by anyone here (at least as I understand it). Thus the title of this thread :-) I understand the arguments along the lines of it's in the hands, it's in the clipped power amp, it's in the loudness (stressed JBLs), etc. All true to some degree, sure--and I've tried some of it, just ask my neighbors :shock: But there's some secret sauce in the preamp that eludes us ... and I can't give up my obsession!


It's not in the preamp( Twins), imho, we have that part nailed. Stay tuned............

~waldo
"Tone is in the instruments. Technique in the hands. Do what you will." ~ quote from some guy at the TGP forum
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby eric » Sun Apr 28, 2013 7:24 am

I love a good Cliffhanger!!!
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby lunasparks » Sun Apr 28, 2013 7:44 am

waldo041 wrote: It's not in the preamp( Twins), imho, we have that part nailed. Stay tuned............

~waldo



Oh, I'm tuned baby. I'm tuned! :cool:
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby mgbills » Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:10 pm

Now I'm tuned!

Last year I bought 7 metric tons of gear. This year I'm woodshedding. Woodshedding! WooooodShedding!!!!

But...This is a great thread...with a cliff-hanger.
"Hi Ho...the Carrion Crow...FoldeRoldeRiddle"
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Re: Really, can anyone actually nail this tone?

Postby mijknahs » Thu May 02, 2013 2:46 pm

Here's my latest attempt (to actually nail this tone). My guitar is not going through any additional amplification like a PA so you are hearing just the speakers (not a mic'd cab through a PA).

Sugaree:
http://ia801700.us.archive.org/0/items/ ... 7d1t01.mp3
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