Europe 72 tunes pitch changed

When it doesn't fit anywhere else

Postby I'm on the Bozo Bus » Thu Dec 20, 2007 10:29 am

True Panda.....
If my half-baked (Perhaps full-baked) theory is correct, Tape machine expecting regulated 110VAC and receives a sloppy / un-conditioned 115 VAC, I would think it would speed it up.
But hey.... I'm ONLY guessing. I have a building full of electrical engineers... I'll go check with them. Naturally they will want to know the serial number of the tape machine in question, if it had all 4 screws in the mounting brackets and were they wearing socks during the recording process....Engineers......
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Postby HOWEYMAN » Thu Dec 20, 2007 1:57 pm

Hi again people, I haven't posted in a while, my access to a PC has been limited.

This is very interesting that someone brought up this topic, for I alwalys have thought Europe 72' sounded differen't but really didn't think nothing of it.

I hope this isn't a dumb question, but I am wondering how changeing the key of a song would speed it up? I a under the impression that you can play the same tempo in any given key. If the song is the key of E, and the tape is sped up, isn't is just a faster tempo in the key of E? How would changing the speed sharpen the song? How would sharpening the song speed it up? Please help me understand.
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Postby GratefulPat » Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:16 pm

no it does bring the key up, think about an old record player... if u drop it to the half or 3/4 speed(whichever it is)the pitch will drop a step as well.. or when you fast forward someones voice and it gets all chipmunky sounding, same thing applies
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Postby BlobWeird » Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:34 pm

HOWEYMAN wrote:Hi again people, I haven't posted in a while, my access to a PC has been limited.

This is very interesting that someone brought up this topic, for I alwalys have thought Europe 72' sounded differen't but really didn't think nothing of it.

I hope this isn't a dumb question, but I am wondering how changeing the key of a song would speed it up? I a under the impression that you can play the same tempo in any given key. If the song is the key of E, and the tape is sped up, isn't is just a faster tempo in the key of E? How would changing the speed sharpen the song? How would sharpening the song speed it up? Please help me understand.


Think about when you fast forward a cassette and you hear that Alvin and the Chipmunks thing goin on with the singing. Obviously it wont be the same key. But changing the key of a song would NOT speed it up in the slightest bit lol I mean obviously it all depends on how fast YOU play it. Just like vice versa if you play somethin on your guitar 10x faster than it is usually played it obviously wont change key just tempo.
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Postby bucketorain » Fri Dec 21, 2007 2:19 pm

i'm wondering if anyone from the Dead family knows the answer to this question?

figuring that this is one of the most comprehensive dead forums out there, it may be of interest for the someone from the Dead to clue us in as to what really happened.

IS THERE ANYONE OUT THERE?

funny, i just flashed back trying to get to the phil zone at RFK in 90 after the rain..."PHIL, HAS ANYONE SEEN PHIL" lol
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Re: Europe 72 tunes pitch changed

Postby dtalks » Tue Oct 15, 2013 10:18 pm

This always bugged me when I tried to play along with Europe 72. I believe they sped it up because it sounded better. Supposedly this was a practice for some old blues records, most notably Robert Johnson. If you try to play along with his records you'll see they are also not at 440. The Dead had a history of messing with stuff in the studio. Anthem is a mix of live and studio. Who played the piano on Wharf Rat on the live skull and roses LP? I've heard they set up after the 72 tour and recorded to augment the europe 72 tracks especially the vocals. I would be interested to hear from someone who was in on the process.
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Re: Europe 72 tunes pitch changed

Postby TI4-1009 » Wed Oct 16, 2013 5:35 am

Six year old thread brought back to life! Ya gotta love it.
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Re: Europe 72 tunes pitch changed

Postby James-T » Wed Oct 16, 2013 7:13 am

If you've got the box set you will know all the shows are pretty much perfect pitch including the content from the last two sides of the Europe 72 album. That's the Truckin and Morning Dew from the Lyceum. There is only one show that's slightly off and I suspect they were just tuned funny that day.

There are a few examples on the box set where Bobby's Gibson goes horribly out of tune and one where Jerry try's to tune to Bobby's bad tuning mid China Rider (I think it's from a Lyceum mid run show).

The biggest surprise on the box set I just discovered the other day. It's a Big River sound check (they did not play that tune in any of the actual shows). It's slow, funky and Jerry sings it. It sounds like the Jerry Band. Bob is as loud in the mix and does some great guitar fills and riffs. Worth a listen.

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