"Sugar Magnolia" Grateful Dead tour bus

Chat about Equipment Info

Postby tigerstrat » Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:43 pm

hesgone95 wrote:The Dead with a much more positive upbeat vibe...if that makes any sense.


Except in the murder ballads maybe ;^) ... or when they were spawning swarms of psychic spiders...
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Postby Tennessee Jedi » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:50 am

Beyond never having heard stories about this bus, what strikes me as suspect is the claim that Jim Morrison and the Doors visted the boys. I was a pretty hardcore Jim fan in my teens and read quite few biographies, including Densmore's, and I don't recall ever having read that there was contact between the two bands.

I just saw something on TV about the Doors and Robby Krieger said he didnt like the Dead because they wouldnt lend the Doors some amps or something ...
he said something about the L.A scene was different than The San Fran scene or something lame ...

:D
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Postby CountryMile Cadillac » Thu Aug 14, 2008 7:01 am

Rusty Griswald is waiting to get on the bus... What the hell is he doing on the picture?
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Postby Tennessee Jedi » Thu Aug 14, 2008 8:16 am

Good Eyes Part 2 !
Maybe he's looking for Puffy McPuffington.
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Postby wisedyes » Thu Aug 14, 2008 9:00 am

I remember reading in "Conversations With the Dead" by David Gans ( a collection of interviews with band members and some road crew members, and Owsley ) that Garcia did not care for the Doors at all.

He said that they had played some shows together in LA, and that first of all, the Doors' sound was thin and brittle live - no power,no depth, due to the lack of bass, etc. His comment was that the Dead "blew them off the fucking stage".

Secondly, he considered Jim Morrison a total Mick Jagger rip-off ( showmanship-wise ) and a second rate poet, at best. His quote was along the lines of "Keats was great, Rimbaud was great, Dylan is great. Jim Morrison isn't fucking great, sorry". He also found the LA scene ( as did Phil ) to be plastic, phony and overly filled with scammers, of which he conssidered the Doors and John Phillips to be the vanguard of.

So, I'm thinking they most likely didn't hang out a whole lot.
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Postby Good Times » Thu Aug 14, 2008 9:31 am

I would agree, in all the readings I have done on both Jerry Garcia and Jim Morrison, that they weren't looking to hang out together in their spare time.

Whatever the "true" story of the bus is, may never be know but just the possibilty of the things that happened there are pretty cool.
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Postby CountryMile Cadillac » Thu Aug 14, 2008 9:42 am

We know that Garcia and Joplin were buddies as well as Crosby. Apparently their views on Morrison were similar...
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONfx8ZTc7MY[/youtube]
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Postby krzykat » Thu Aug 14, 2008 5:12 pm

i think i read that when they were on the same bill as a gesture of good faith Jerry gave Jim some L and Jim asked if it was Owsley because he "Only ate Owsley L" and Jerry replied "Who do you think we are?" apparently Jim thought he was a messenger or something
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Postby hesgone95 » Thu Aug 14, 2008 5:47 pm

tigerstrat wrote:
hesgone95 wrote:The Dead with a much more positive upbeat vibe...if that makes any sense.


Except in the murder ballads maybe ;^) ... or when they were spawning swarms of psychic spiders...



hahaha...I guess you got me there TS...and boy that must've been some good L if you saw the Dead spawn swarms of psycic spiders...:lol:

But even in the depths of the deepest, darkest Dark Star it was still a way more positive vibe than Jim singing "father, yes son, I want to kill you, mother, I want to fuck you all night long"...or "dead cats, dead rats suckin on a soldiers sperm".

Just my .02¢
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Postby willmusic » Thu Aug 14, 2008 6:25 pm

hesgone95 wrote:
tigerstrat wrote:
hesgone95 wrote:The Dead with a much more positive upbeat vibe...if that makes any sense.


Except in the murder ballads maybe ;^) ... or when they were spawning swarms of psychic spiders...



hahaha...I guess you got me there TS...and boy that must've been some good L if you saw the Dead spawn swarms of psycic spiders...:lol:

But even in the depths of the deepest, darkest Dark Star it was still a way more positive vibe than Jim singing "father, yes son, I want to kill you, mother, I want to fuck you all night long"...or "dead cats, dead rats suckin on a soldiers sperm".

Just my .02¢




Well said. I tried sooo hard in high school to find something...SOMETHING to dig about the Doors. Needless to say they have never been for me. I never liked his "poetry". I can name a hundred other poets who's stuff I would read before considering his...alright, I lied...I wouldn't consider it at all. Overrated IMO. Some of the music was okay to me at best, but Morrison's ideas of himself were way too grand.
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Postby hesgone95 » Thu Aug 14, 2008 9:11 pm

I think the thing about Jim Morrison is that he appeals to teenage boys, or men who still have that mentality...that swaggering, d**k swinging machismo that just reeks of testosterone. Needless to say the Doors are pretty popular here in Mexico. Personally I think that as I matured, both mentally and musically, I just sort of lost interest in that attitude and realized how superficial it was.

But don't get me wrong, I don't hate the Doors and I think Jim came up with some with some good stuff lyrically and the band wasn't too bad. But I'd be inclined to agree that calling him a poet is stretching things a bit. Still Morrison Hotel or LA Woman are decent albums. And I have some great quater or half memories of good time listening to the Doors in high school.

:D :cheers: :hd: :drink:
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Postby darksun » Fri Aug 15, 2008 11:35 am

I agree with most ppl here... The Doors are over-rated, IMO.

Much like AC/DC or all hip hop artists... Just fueled by popularity.
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Postby mttourpro » Fri Aug 15, 2008 1:26 pm

Personality and ablility are two different things...you may not like Morrison, his words or his actions, but I gotta say that the musicianship in the band was pretty good IMO--especially the players.
I'd also say the songwriting was very good as well.
They certainly outlasted a lot of other bands from their day when it comes to historic impact and the fact they're still on the radio a lot.

Ray Manzerek is and was a bad-ass player. As someone mentioned, they didn't have a bass player--that's because he covered the bass parts on an ancient bass-synth while he played some pretty great organ/keys.
Guitar and drums weren't too shabby either.

Personally, I've always liked the Doors and always will so I felt I should put in a word to the contrary.

Some people thought Frank Zappa was an asshole too but I don't think anyone who's ever really listened to his music is gonna legitimately question his overall musical abilities.

Flame away if you'd like...MT
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Postby pappypgh » Fri Aug 15, 2008 1:40 pm

I'll add to Tour Pro's rant...

The Doors - good band. Manzarek also played bass with HIS FEET on some of their stuff with Hammond-like footpedals. Densmore - pretty solid drummer for a rock & roll band. Krieger - pretty great guitarist, IMO - had plenty of chops and tone. Morrison - The Great American Poet? Sorry, nothing more than a drunk with a pen & a microphone. His only talent was getting an audience filled with drugged up people really pumped up with his physical actions.

The LA scene - nothing substantial. I know John Philips is included in a lot of that, but to ME, the Mamas & Papas BLOW AWAY what Jim Morrison did. I love their harmonies and a lot of their songs. Do I dare compare along the same lines as the GD? Fuck no.
Jim Morrison was a freaking JOKE, IMO. Never liked him - never will.

You could have put ANYONE in the lead role of that band of any vocal talent and The Doors would have succeeded. It was the BAND that made the songs, not Morrison.

I'd rather see Mick Jagger any day.

The Great American Poet - I say it's a toss-up between Bob Dylan and Robert Hunter, thank you very much.

:cool:
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Postby DooDahDan » Fri Aug 15, 2008 7:25 pm

Don't know if Manzarek played with his feet. I caught the VH1 classic album for their first record last night and he only mentioned playing bass on a fender rhodes bass keyboard (a la Ray Charles) with his left hand.

In any event, I wouldn't totally trash the LA scene. After all, Neil Young came from the LA "scene" before migrating north (unless, of course, you put Neil in the same vacuous mix as Morrison). :roll:
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