Covering the Dead's Sound the Easiest

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Covering the Dead's Sound the Easiest

Postby Scary Pete » Sun Jan 13, 2008 2:03 pm

Well I'm not extremely educated in the field of equipment, so I was just curious as to what is the best way to cover multiple sounds of the dead the easiest. Like for example is there a pedal that has many built in functions/presets that nail the sound, or something along that line.
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Postby myoung6923 » Sun Jan 13, 2008 10:34 pm

oh now THAT's a can of worms!

Short answer - no.

Long answer - well... it just depends on how much you REALLY want to get HOW close to "the sound".

There's an awful lot of us that have spent an enormous amount of time, money, research, sweat and solder to really get that sound down. It seems to be almost like a mirage - in that as soon as you think you're close it's always just a little further away.

There's a whole science to it. I don't think that there exists any multi effects pedal that can really get the sound. You might find something that will give you elements of what you want - and you might be happy with just that. But, if you are like the rest of us nut cases in here - once you get used to it you will begin to realize it's shortcomings and seek out better things to get "the sound".

For a decent chunk of change you can get the right components that will get you VERY close to the sound that you are looking for.

Another question though - which sound do you mean? Jerry or Bobby? Then which era do you mean?

Most of the sound is created from the specific hardware that was used - amp, speakers, pickups, guitar modifications, amp modifications... and THEN effects.

Welcome to the first stage of Gear Acquisition Syndrome.
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Postby kevo » Sun Jan 13, 2008 11:41 pm

myoung6923 wrote:
Most of the sound is created from the specific hardware that was used - amp, speakers, pickups, guitar modifications, amp modifications... and THEN effects.


Don't forget the fingers!
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Postby tigerstrat » Mon Jan 14, 2008 10:37 am

You can't even "nail" the sound using the exact same equipment and settings used by Jerry (? Bob? Mickey? -the way the question was phrased its not even clear we are talking about guitar... Eileen Law? Laird Grant? :lol: ) - why? because what Kevo said is true- it's mostly in the fingers, or more properly, in the player as a whole. Nobody has ever truly nailed Garcia... Kadlecik, Mattson, myself, Barry Sless, Stu Ross... NOBODY.

However, YES there are probably hundreds of choices for getting a single pedal w/multiple effects that will "approximate" many of the types of effects used by Garcia or Weir... sure, find one with an envelope effect and most will include an overdrive, a delay/reverb, and maybe a phase, and you'll be able to combine them all. But as Mike above pointed out, you will probably soon start to notice the shortcomings and/or cheesiness and/or inflexibility of these type of "does-it-all" kind of boxes.
"There, in huge black letters, was 'The Grateful Dead'. It just... cancelled my mind out."-Garcia
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Postby jjbankhead » Mon Jan 14, 2008 10:57 am

i am equally ignorant of equippment as far as i dont own anything fancy expensive or close to what any of the guys in the dead used.

however it is my opinion that the dead never "nailed"their sound. Jerry was always changing his equipment or adding stuff to his gear, i just watched him play a strat on truckin up to buffalo, and he had both the tiger and the rose or rosebud by alembic. i believe he went through several different preamps and pick ups from alembic and a fender preamp as well (again i am not sure about any of this)

my point is Jerry like all guitarists (and i am including phil bobby mick and bill in this as well) was always looking for something cool to change his sound.

i would suggest find what makes you happy and run with it until you get bored of it and add something new.
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Postby tigerstrat » Mon Jan 14, 2008 3:40 pm

I've got a well-used but working Ibanez PT-3 floor multi-fx pedal that goes to the first $75. In "edit" mode (the way I used it) it has separate footswitches for compression(which yes, I sometimes used- this was in the late 90s), OD/distortions(including TS9), Chorus/flange and reverbs/delays... or you can set it to go to preset combinations but it has that nagging 16-bit fraction-of-a-second lag time between presets when used in that mode. I wound up using the edit mode exclusively. No envelope,octave or phase, and you can't insert any outboard fx in between the fx on the PT-3. Not much of a Jerry box I guess! Kind of decent as a poor-man's Phish/Jazz Fusion-thru-Metal box, or for a certain range of Weirisms maybe. Pretty decent as an acoustic preamp; I might still employ it for that but i almost never do amplified acoustic anymore.
"There, in huge black letters, was 'The Grateful Dead'. It just... cancelled my mind out."-Garcia
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Postby I'm on the Bozo Bus » Mon Jan 14, 2008 11:54 pm

For what it's worth.....
I recently picked up a XT live. I have gotten pretty close using it, along with some of the "Old as dirt" FX I have owned for years.
It may not be the sound.... Is there really a "The sound"?
As mentioned, find what you like and what you think is close.
When it comes down to it.... It is in the hands / fingers.
There is a video out there somewhere (YouTube) that is a quick cut of Jer playing either Tiger or Rose and the sound IS Jerry. It's hard to tell, but I don't even think he is playing through an amp.

By the way... I'm on the road for work... and lo and behold... I'm in old El Paso... Felina, where are you????
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Postby strumminsix » Tue Jan 15, 2008 12:29 am

I'm on the Bozo Bus wrote:By the way... I'm on the road for work... and lo and behold... I'm in old El Paso... Felina, where are you????


Phil, did ya know the protagonist in El Paso didn't die for killing Felina's "other man"??

He was shot for being a horse rustler. "I picked a good one he looked like could run"
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Postby I'm on the Bozo Bus » Tue Jan 15, 2008 12:51 am

I always thought it was his dear love for Felina?

"One night a wild young cowboy came in,
Wild as the West Texas wind.
Dashing and daring,
A drink he was sharing
With wicked Felina,
The girl that I loved.

So in anger I

Challenged his right for the love of this maiden.
Down went his hand for the gun that he wore.
My challenge was answered in less than a heart-beat;
The handsome young stranger lay dead on the floor."

Tired...
I had a two hour heads up that I was "Riding to town"
I'm hittin the ol' bunk rack for tomorrow

I must ride...

To the west Texas town of old El Paso,
Tell these guys how to run their show
If I do right, I will make right and off to Rosies I'll run...

It's late, I'm punchy...
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Postby strumminsix » Tue Jan 15, 2008 1:56 am

I'm on the Bozo Bus wrote:I always thought it was his dear love for Felina?

"So in anger I Challenged his right for the love of this maiden. Down went his hand for the gun that he wore. My challenge was answered in less than a heart-beat;The handsome young stranger lay dead on the floor."



Oh he'd have had it coming for that but in the west it was a challenge, the men let it be and the law would come after him. The protagonist instead had cowboys coming after him - not the law...
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Postby Tennessee Jedi » Tue Jan 15, 2008 7:51 am

I always just thought it was the dead guys buddies that just wanted revenge.
I like the horse thieving thing,though.
Stealing horses was a serious crime back in the day. :cool:
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Postby AugustWest » Tue Jan 15, 2008 7:55 am

If you watched Commanche Moon this week you would understand what all the fuss is about with the horse stealing. Val kilmer and westerns are sure to please (think Tombstone.) I pretty sure marty robbins himself said in an interview once that horse stealing is probably what got everyone in an uproar. I could be wrong though.
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Postby I'm on the Bozo Bus » Tue Jan 15, 2008 11:13 pm

(To plagiarize yet another tune....)
I guess the end result is what matters...
Left his dead ass there on the side of the road....
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Postby SoulShakedown » Wed Jan 16, 2008 8:32 am

strumminsix wrote:Oh he'd have had it coming for that but in the west it was a challenge, the men let it be and the law would come after him. The protagonist instead had cowboys coming after him - not the law...


Excellent point! I'd never thought of that.

One thing that always struck me was the Dead played elpaso with a happy feel to it when, in fact, it was a sad, Robins' cowboy tale.
His job was to share the light, not to master.
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Postby strumminsix » Wed Jan 16, 2008 8:46 am

SoulShakedown wrote:
strumminsix wrote:Oh he'd have had it coming for that but in the west it was a challenge, the men let it be and the law would come after him. The protagonist instead had cowboys coming after him - not the law...


Excellent point! I'd never thought of that.

One thing that always struck me was the Dead played elpaso with a happy feel to it when, in fact, it was a sad, Robins' cowboy tale.


Ain't it the truth?! However it's hard to make a waltz sound sad in general then add in the uptempo and it sounds happy!
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